Mattress Forum

For that reason perhaps, the first night was more difficult than I had anticipated, even though I used everything I had at my disposition. I layered the inch of latex, one inch of cheap egg crate from Wall-Mart, a small (about my width), thin (perhaps 3/4) and very soft piece of foam that I used for camping a long time ago and then an old and beaten quilt, made of polyester. Even with all of this, I was only able to sleep 4 hours until it became too uncomfortable. The pressure is mostly even, between the hips all the way to the shoulders, so I know that it's flat. I can only stay 5 minutes on my back (but in my present condition, that is true for pretty much any surface I lay on) so I alternated between sides. I stayed up 3 hours and went back in for 3 more hours.

I remember breaking in the 250 and it was even worst for the first 3 or 4 weeks, until it slowly got better, so I have a little bit of hope. In the meantime, I thought I could try something from Costco (since I can always return it and get a full refund) or another cheap topper from Wall-Mart, that I would use instead of the quilt. Perhaps I should invest more and get the 3 inches of latex from Costco to replace all the toppers I am using right now?

http://www.costco.ca/Browse/Productgroup.aspx?Prodid=10340594&search=topper&Mo=10&cm_re=1_en-_-Top_Left_Nav-_-Top_search&lang=en-CA&Nr=P_CatalogName:BCCA&Sp=S&N=0&whse=BCCA&Dx=mode+matchallpartial&Ntk=Text_Search&Dr=P_CatalogName:BCCA&Ne=4000000&D=topper&Ntt=topper&No=2&Ntx=mode+matchallpartial&Nty=1&topnav=&s=1

A friend says I should put the mattress on the floor and let my wife walk on it for a few minutes, to accelerate the breaking in. I don't know if this is a good idea or not...

Their "standard" pocket coil is 15.5 gauge coils which is re-inforced on the edge with 2 rows of 13.25 gauge coils.

They have many different names for their "firm" mattresses such as extra firm, luxury firm, plush firm, ultra firm, cushion firm, and more depending on the store selling it and where in the lineup it fits. The only one they actually call just firm is their studio model which has shorter coils (some stores don't differentiate and just say firm for any of their variants).

Some versions of their firm are made with the thinner coils with less foam on top. This makes it feel firm even though it has the thinner coils.

Some versions of their firm are made with the thicker coils (13.75 gauge) with a little more foam on top. This makes it feel firm as well. Their "extra firm" is like this and it is usually a thicker mattress (about 1/2 inch thicker) than their "luxury firm" since it uses more foam with stronger coils of the same height. I know that this is weird since their extra firm uses more foam and you would think it's the other way around.

Because of this ... I don't know which one your mattress is. If it's the extra firm then you have thicker stronger coils with more poly, if it's the luxury firm you have thinner weaker coils with less poly. To make matters worse, many places will tell you something like "it has 13.25 gauge coils" and this may be true for the outer 2 rows but the rest of the mattress may be 15.5. They may not even know this. Even their strongest pocket coils are not as strong as other manufacturers or types of innersprings and may not be as suitable for heavier weights.

Usually ... the "extra" firm or the "plush" firm have the stonger coils but with different thicknesses and/or types of foam on top but this may not always be true in every store.

Usually ... the "luxury" firm has the thinner coils with slightly less poly than the "extra" but this also may not be true in every store.

Of course this "confusion" is compounded with the many many different names used for the same mattress and by the fact that as you go up in the range the spring/poly parts of this change a bit. (using more and different foams etc). But yours is the "basic" model which means it's either extra firm or luxury firm.

So ... you either have thinner coils with less poly or thicker coils with more poly. Both would feel firm and be called "firm".

In either case the difference in poly terms is about 3/8" of poly which is not so much. The difference in coil terms is more.

In your case I am hoping (and guessing) that you have the stronger coils with a little more foam but the description you linked to earlier would be similar to the construction of the luxury firm (It said you had 13.25 gauge and this was probably wrong in either case since this is the gauge of the edge coils. Assuming they meant 13.75, either the amount of poly or the coil gauge was incorrect in their description).

The bottom line is this ... I would use the thinnest firmest layer of toppers that would give you the pressure relief you need.

Thinner because you don't want to "build a complete mattress" over the coils so that the coils can "help" with the pressure relief and compress a bit which would help them support you and prevent your heavier parts from sinking in too far (compressed coils give more support). If you go too thick, you will get the pressure relief from the thicker layer but the coils would also compress and put you out of alignment.

Slightly firmer (but not so firm it causes pressure issues) because you want any help you can get with alignment issues ... even if it comes from the comfort layers.

You could certainly try the 3" costco latex topper but I would definitely call them first to find out the ILD since I didn't see it on the site. At least Costco's return policy makes it easier to experiment :)

And I wouldn't "break it in" by walking on it. This is usually more appropriate for some types of memory foam or for high end mattresses that need "re-distributing" in their comfort layers (similar to massaging them). With this type and construction of mattress all you are likely to do is make it wear out faster. I wouldn't do anything to "speed up" the breakdown of the poly.

Phoenix

I'm going to experiment tonight by sleeping on the eggcrate (3/4 of an inch + the latex folded in two, for a total of 2.75 inches. I just made the bed this way and I know for a fact that I wouldn't want to have more than 3 inches of foam alltogether. So it's either the 3 inches from Costco by itself or another inch of latex, probably from Foambymail (they only have 20 and 32 ILD, so I'm not sure what would be best to go for).

I'm still hoping the springs will start giving in within a few weeks since they're not as strong and there is less of them as there was in the NXG (13.25 vs 13.75 - 980 vs 800). Of course, if it does, I would have purchased the Costco topper for nothing.

This is so frustrating. Why does it have to be so complicated?!

They complicate it just to prevent the kind of consumer education that would cause their sales to suffer.

I would probably tend to a known ILD as foam by mail may be risky in terms of what you actually get. Some of the stories on the forum have confirmed that sometimes you get what you order and sometimes you don't get even close.

If the topper from Costco is in a reasonable range of ILD (and I'd call them first just to check), then this is the way I'd probably go if for no other reason than their return policy.

If the springs start "giving" in a few weeks (as opposed to the foam) enough to make a difference, then that would be bad news since they should be consistent over many years. You want the springs to remain firm and use the comfort layers to provide pressure relief.

Phoenix

What range of ILD would you consider suitable if I go with the 3 inches from Costco? If only purchasing another inch, who should I go with that doesn't charge an arm and a leg to deliver in Canada? FBM was pretty cheap all the way around. Only bad thing is that it took a full 2 weeks from the time I ordered to get the parcel.

I'd probably be looking for around 24 ILD give or take (it's impossible for me to know for sure without some specific feedback from you knowing what latex you have laid on and how it felt)

I really like the rejuvenite but you'd have to call and see what it would cost to ship. If the 28 worked it would be great and the 19 may be OK too but probably a little soft for you.

The STL one is a great deal but I'm pretty sure it's 14 ILD which I think would be too soft. Don't know if they ship  to Canada or how much.

In general I would probably go with either places like Costco and Sams club for the return policy or mattresses.net and sleepez since they seem to have the best price/selection combination and you won't go far wrong with either of them. Make sure about shipping to Canada and returns first though. Also make sure they are either covered or that you order a cover with them as latex breaks down without one. I wouldn't take the chance on just covering them with sheets or a mattress pad.

Dunlop in a little softer ILD's is another option that may work and when I have the chance I'll post some sources for that as well that weren't in the Talalay list.

A few more that I haven't had a chance to check out in in any real detail yet are ...

http://foamandhomedecor.com/foam.php#latexfoam Canadian but don't know their prices

http://www.supremecomfort.com/shipping.htm They may have a warehouse in Canada that ships toppers

http://www.tmasc.ca/latextoppers.html Canadian. They sell Natura toppers that are very nice but they're a little on the high side (being diplomatic here :))

http://www.idealmattress.com/index.html Canadian and it doesn't say so on their site but they may have toppers

http://www.foamite.com/mat_other.php Canadian and sells Dunlopillo but rather expensive.

http://www.dreameasy.com/products/100-natural-latex Canadian and might sell toppers

http://www.snugsleep.com/latex-toppers.html Canadian and sell toppers but they're Dunlop and probably cheaper to buy from US. Don't know for sure

http://www.discountfoam.ca/usesoffoam/usesoffoam.htm Canadian but I don't know if they sell latex

http://www.foamshop.com/ourProducts.shtml Canadian but I don't know if they sell latex

http://www.bfffoamcorp.com/products.php?id=35 Canadian but I don't know if they sell to little guys like us. Would sure be worth a call

http://www.thefoamking.com/mattress-toppers.html Canadian but I don't know if they sell latex

http://www.sureline.ca/mattressproducts.html Canadian and sell Resilitex which is "fake" latex with similar properties. Don't know if they have actual latex

http://www.thefoamstore.ca/pro_mattresses.php Canadian and doesn't look like they carry latex but may be worth a call

http://www.foamorder.com/clearance.html#foam-toppers These guys are American but often have some pretty good deals in their clearance section. They sell Talalay and Dunlop but mostly Dunlop.

There's more (including checking out local foam shops) but I still plan to fill in the blanks regarding Canadian sources for toppers (and other things). For now the best prices may be ordering from the US and shipping across the border. It may also be worth calling some of the Toronto and Quebec manufacturers I listed earlier to see if they will sell you a topper as well.

Phoenix

I contacted Foam and Home Decor, waiting for a reply.

I have a feeling that my back is in a state of shock right now, so to speak. Even lying on the couch or sitting in my old chair starts to hurt within minutes while they use to be comfortable enough for me to watch a whole movie. I'm therefore unable to make any valid statement about what feels comfortable or not, just what hurts more or less...