Mattress Forum

Jersey sheets sleep very hot. I hate them.

I recommend 100% cotton but somewhere around 300 thread count. Once you get up into the high thread counts the sheets do not breathe as well. In my experience what works best is the lowest thread count that does not feel to "scratchy" or "rough". I think mine are around 350 thread count and I am very sensitive to rough material on my body and I like these just fine. The times I have tried higher thread counts, they feel great to the touch but sleep too hot for me.

As I recall we had a thread about this maybe a year ago, and some people agreed with me on this. Try doing a search for "sheets".

Cotton Types 
Cotton is the most widely used fiber for fabric because of its strength, durability and breathability. The word "staple" refers to fiber length. When someone refers to "long staple cotton" they are referring to variety 1, 2, or 3. The longer the fiber size of a variety, the more difficult it is to grow, and the more difficult it is to process. Hence the longer the staple, the more expensive it becomes. 

(The image below shows the approximate relative sizes of the fibers.)

1. Sea Island Cotton 
Sea Island Cotton is in extremely limited supply, and is very expensive to grow and to process. It is typically used in very expensive men's shirts. 

2. Egyptian Cotton 
Egyptian Cotton was developed from stocks that originated in South and Central America. Menoufi is the most widely used variety. The highly prized Giza variety has exceptionally strong fibers about 1½" long, and is used in the best qualities of embroidery thread, and the finest cotton fabrics for sheets, down bedding covers, and duvet tickings. 

3. Pima Cotton 
Pima cotton is in between Egyptian Cotton and American Upland long staple in length and price. It is a very good quality. 

4. American Upland Long Staple 
This cotton is only "Long Staple" in comparison to American Upland Short Staple cotton. The American Upland cottons now comprise up to 90% of the worlds crop. They are much easier to grow and process, and are therefore much less costly. They are perfectly adequate for medium quality fabrics. They make poor downproof fabrics for duvets and pillows, as they will ultimately leak. They are also unsuitable for high thread count sheets, as they will feel limp and coarse after a few launderings. This is the cotton used in bargain duvets, and in inexpensive "luxury" sheets. 

5. American Upland Short Staple 
A less expensive version of cotton, and a very basic quality. Suitable for denim for blue jeans. 

6. Asia Short Staple 
Asia Short staple is very easy to grow and process, and hence makes very cheap cloth. Unfortunately, lightweight fabrics made from this cotton are very weak and limp. They wear out quickly, and launder poorly.

Both 300 thread count fabrics: One made with genuine Egyptian cotton (right), and the other made with cheap, short staple cotton (left).

Weave Types

Yarns

Fabric is woven from "Weft" yarns, which run sideways across the loom, and therefore across the fabric; and "Warp" yarns, which run along the length of the fabric. 

Types of Weaves

In weaving, yarns are interlaced according to preset patterns, or weaves. The yarn count and number of warp and weft yarns to the square inch determine the closeness or looseness of a weave. Woven fabrics may also be varied by the proportion of warp yarns to weft yarns. The most basic weaves are plain, satin, and twill. 

Plain

The plain weave is the simplest of all weaves, a simple over and under, alternating each thread, to make a "checkerboard" pattern. It is also the strongest of the basic weaves because the yarns are tightly interlaced. The advantage of this weave is that the very light cloths can be achieved, so it is suitable for making the very lightest down proof fabric for duvets. However, it is quite plain in appearance. 

Satin

The surface of satin weave cloth is almost made up entirely of warp or filling floats*, since in the repeat of the weave each yarn of the one system passes or floats over (or under) all but one yarn of the opposite yarn system. While the highest thread counts are made with this weave, the resulting fabric weighs a little more than what can be achieved with plain weaves. It is very pleasing to the eye, and may have a simple, smooth lustrous appearance, or have patterns woven into it. Sateen is a particular style of satin weave. 

*Simply put, the float is the portion of the yarn that you see, which extends over two or more threads. 

Sateen

The difference between satin and sateen is the fact that sateen floats are made up of weft yarns, rather than of warp yarns. 




Twill

Denim is the best known twill. It is identified by the quite visible diagonal lines in the fabric, and is often a simple "over two, under one" weave. Heavier fabrics are made this way, and they are suitable for featherproof applications such as feather pillows and featherbeds.

Jersey and damask are other ways of weaving fabrics.  Jersey fabrics are stretchier but not as smooth as normal plain (percale) or sateen cottons.  Damask is another way of saying Jacquard fabrics, these are usually done for decorative purposes, usually only intended for use on duvet covers and decorative pillows/shams.  Plain (percale) or Sateen are usually the most desirable weave types for high quality sheeting.

Thread Count 
Thread Count is Not the Whole Story...
Thread count is simply a measure of how many threads are present in a square inch of fabric. It is a combination of the number of horizontal and vertical threads found in that square inch. 

Thread count is one relatively minor measure of quality in a fabric. The quality of the fiber used to make the thread is far more important than the thread count of the fabric. To make high thread count fabrics, thread must be spun very fine in order to fit a lot into a square inch. 

It is entirely appropriate to use short staple cotton for fabrics such as denim, canvas and other heavier fabrics. However, when it is used to make fine threads, they are too weak, and the resulting fabric will be unsatisfactory. 

Start With Good Cotton Fiber ... 

Low quality thread makes a low quality 300 thread count fabric

These fabrics have the same 300 thread count. The one on the left is of a much lower quality. You can see that the threads are of an uneven size, which results in an uneven weave. There are thin patches throughout this fabric. This will cause the fabric to wear out faster and launder poorly, as it is only as strong as its weakest areas. Poor quality thread is spun from cheap shorter staple cottons. 

High quality thread makes a high quality 300 thread count fabric

 

 

The fabric on the right is a German made sateen. The mill started with a high quality thread to weave this cloth. It is even, smooth, luxurious and it will provide many years of service. This thread is spun from a more expensive long staple cotton.

 

 

Good quality long staple cotton will spin into good quality thread, and good quality thread will weave into good quality fabric. All three stages must be completed in a quality fashion, or the result will be inferior. Some fabrics will appear to be a bargain, but they won't be a pleasure to use, and they won't last. While not obvious on the surface, you can see that close magnified inspection shows a surprisingly large difference.

This close-up shows a two ply thread that has been 'untwisted' to show its construction

I printed out this thread due to the pictures and description that Budgy sent in that is a real help to all of us.

Modal fabrics are much softer than cotton, although not quite as durable...so they require a more delicate washing treatment.  But from a luxury standpoint they are quickly becoming popular! St. Geneve and SDH both have some really nice modal sheets.  

 1. what are damask sheets

2. What are jersey sheets.

Jim, I don't find jersey sheets hot. I don't know why you say that?

Are you talking about some other sheets?

3. How do I identify if Egyptian cotton sheets are really of good quality.

I got some from costco and I wonder if they are really of good quality. They are 400n thread count.

4. Pima sheets - I have seen in 600 thread count. I wonder if they would feel hot?

Thank you budgy.

Damask is another word for Jacquard or Jacquard weaving. It is really only done for decorative purposes, usually for duvet covers and pillow shams, bedskirts that kind of thing. Patterns can be all one colour or multitiude of colours.  I am going to use a 3rd party website that I think is well done to try and illustrate some of these examples.

http://www.snuggledown.com/s/catalog/duvet_covers/agadir/

^^ This Agadir fabric from SDH is a Jacquard (damask) fabric, the pattern in the fabric is there because of how the fabric is woven. 

http://www.snuggledown.com/s/catalog/duvet_covers/bregano_solid/

^^ This Bregano duvet cover from St. Geneve is also a Jacquard fabric. The pattern is not only woven in the fabric it comes from using differently dyed yarns. This means that the yarns are dyed individually and woven right into the fabric so it will not fade over time.

http://www.snuggledown.com/s/catalog/bonjour_of_switzerland/schlossberg_alena/

** This Alena fabric from Schlossberg is a cotton print.  It is still a pattern, but the fabric is woven in a normal percale or sateen weave, the colour is literally printed onto the cotton.  

Jacquard fabrics are much more durable than prints in terms of not having colour fading over time.  However Jacquards are not typically used for fitted sheets, flat sheets or pillowcases, as after washing the patterns usually become more pronounced in feel and are not as comfortable next to the skin as a normal weave. 

Jersey refers to another weave type that allows the cotton to be much more stretchy.  Jersey fabrics usually wear out very quickly unless very heavy, in which case they will sleep a little bit warmer.  The reason they wear out is for the same reason that most cheap cottons wear out, the weave is uneven to begin with and with further use and laundering the weak spots of the fabric can break and wear very easily.  

At the end of the day the cotton fabric which is lightest is usually the most breathable. Real egyptian cotton fabrics can be woven very finely and still have lots of strength, resulting in usually lighter and more breathable fabrics when comparing similar thread counts.  The lower the strand count the more breathable the fabric will be.  Although not typically as smooth or crisp feeling as a higher strand count sheet (which will also be a little more durable).  If you see 400TC sheets these are in all liklihood a 2 ply 200 thread count fabric, which would be using twisted yarns as illustrated in the first post I made.  600TC would probably be a 2 ply 300 thread count. Its too bad most manufacturers do not list these things as it is important to know.  But realistically if Costco or Walmart is selling it....its not REAL egyptian cotton or real pima cotton, its likely just a small percentage of the cotton fibres used in making the threads.  Price usually is the big indicator of quality. Egyptian cotton fabrics quite literally cannot be mass produced as easily as other cottons, it requires hand picking so the staples are not damaged, it is much more costly to mill.  Look for fabrics that are woven somewhere in Europe, preferably Germany, Italy, Austria, Switzerland...somewhere noted for producing high quality fabrics.  

Expect to see a new, upgraded Pima--Supima is a brand/advertising name for pima.  The new Pima is being test grown in Arizona(the cotton monopoly in California will not allow it to be grown here even though it was developed as a colored cotton in the late 1980's) and Argentina.  It has a staple lenght of well over 2" and can be processed using traditional machines.  Interestingly, this new cotton comes colored--mainly browns and tabacco's without any dyeing.  This is the reason it isn't allowed in california, the farm industry is afraid it will combine with the white cotton grown here and interfere with the premium prices the farmers get.  Last year's crop was purchased by a German manufacturer, all 150,000 bales.

There are many different varieties of Egyptian Cotton, if you go to cotton trading websites you can look at the specs on different cotton species, staple length, amount of light reflected, strength and weavability are all usually listed independently.  There are several species with staple lengths that go over 2", just as there are many Pima cottons with much shorter staple lengths than 1.5".  Weave type and thread count are important...but they are subjective as higher thread count does not mean more comfortable or better quality all the time, weave type is also subjective to preference.  Percales are the strongest but they wrinkle easier and are not as smooth as sateen weaves.  Cotton quality itself is objective and scientifically measurable.  

Supima or 100% American Pima Cotton does get exported to mills around the world...but I have never heard of any of the European mills using it...this doesn't mean the cotton itself isnt of very high quality...but I have just never seen or felt really high quality cotton sheets from India and Pakistan which is where most Supima cotton is being woven, note that most cotton coming from these countries isn't even Pima cotton it is almost always Upland cotton (90% of the world crop).  Im not sure who the best companies are to get something like this from....I believe Tempur in the US sells some high quality Supima Cotton sheets.  My uncle just got a set of Supima sheets and he is ecstatic about the quality of them...not sure where he got them from.

Are there any retail stores in USA where I can go and get some of these Egyptian cotton and Pima sheets?

It is hard to buy over internet when you can't see/touch the sheets. Thus I would like to go to a retail store and get them.

Thanks budgy.

I would go to manufacturer websites and look @ dealer locators to try and see who in your area is carrying the high end sheets.

St. Geneve, Sferra, SDH, Schlossberg, Matouk, PeaCock Alley...there are others too...but I am drawing blanks now

EDIT: I guess I am just saying I dont think any big box stores are trustworthy in this kind of arena...they bring in cheap products and sell them off as luxury goods.