Mattress Forum

This all makes me realize that even if my springs don't work out, I will either buy a cheap mattress with better springs and take it apart and make my own mattress, or see if there's some local factory where they would sell me just the springs, so I could replace them inside the Sealy cover, and go from there.

I doubt that ANY mattress - or hardly any - would be as good - or as flexible - as I can make it myself, by taking it apart like this and puttiing in my own foam on top of the springs. If these don't work out I'll look for a not-too-used matress or a cheap new one that has better springs. I know that if you dig into web sites or just call the manufacturers or whatever, you can usually find out the exact type of springs - type of coil, guage of wire, how they are tied together, etc.

I would never have bought this Sealy if I knew how crappy the foam was inside. I knew it had x amount of foam, but they don't tell you the ILD of the foam, so I had no idea it had THAT much super soft low quality foam inside.

I can't believe we slept on it for as long as we did!

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That's a good point. That would explain why it's only 1/4" - a 1/4 soft foam at the bottom certainly isn't going to affect SUPPORT in any way. I'll keep it to use at the bottom, just to keep the springs from cutting the HR foam I put on top of them.

I don't think I will ever buy another mattress again. I just plan to build my own. My only concern is that the innerspring unit I'm counting on will turn out to be as crappy as the foam on top of it, Even though you keep hearing how the coil unit will last forever, I have to wonder why manufacturers would bother putting a high quality innerspring into a mattress that's really only going to last as long as the cheap PU foam inside it.  Although I gotta say the cutaway of the mattress I bought looked like it had a much more heavy duty coil unit inside. If that's really what they put in...

Thanks for going there! I loved your slideshow.

Oh, and just a thought. Try the half inch of HR foam first. You can always add another half if it's not enough. And if your innerspring is still too soft, you might try doing what BeddyBye did to firm it up. A sheet of 1/4" doorskin plywood over the coils. Might be a little more durable than cardboard if the HR foam alone doesn't do it.

It's such a waste and bad for the environment that many of the mattresses made with materials (cheap PU foams, etc) that aren't durable end up as trash in a landfill. I'm sure the big-name mattress manufacturers know that the foams they use aren't very durable and won't even last through the entire warranty of a mattress. It can take them just about an hour to make a mattress. Do they care that many of their mattresses end up as trash in landfills? It comes down to making money for them. If they would only make higher quality mattresses instead of putting cheap crap on the market,  there would be less of a chance that a customer has to have the mattress exchanged under the warranty or has to buy a replacement mattress and throw out the defective one. Mattresses used to be flippable (there are still some made that way), and so that increased the lifespan of a mattress. It's become a disposable society...things just aren't made like they used to be.

Anyway, Jim, I really hope you get this mattress to be comfortable for you. I applaude you for taking it apart and trying to work with the rest of the mattress sans the cheap foam. Please let us know the end result.

I can truly imagine how flimsy that foam is in your Sealy mattress. I'm keeping my fingers crossed about my new Sealy from Costco...right now it's comfy (the first night was hell, though). But I've noticed that the foam is a little compressed where I've been sleeping in the center of the mattress...if it compresses too much, then my back won't like it.

On the web site www.baybed.com/faq.htm, they state: "Most manufacturers use the lowest grade of foam–a 1.2 lb density (1.2 lbs per cubic foot). We use latex foam rubber, which weights 3 to 4 times as much and will retain its original height and firmness the longest." For most large mattress manufacturers, it's all about making a buck, and using cheap foams means higher profits as well as the fact that the mattresses are not made to last, so people end up buying another mattress within a shorter period of time than years ago when mattresses were flippable. They could use higher quality foams...doing so would mean less warranty claims and better customer satisfaction and longer lasting mattresses. They could make flippable mattresses. I don't know who the heck made the decision to do away with flippable mattresses. Oh, and many mattress sales people highly promote the pillowtops, but a large majority of these pillowtops contain the low density PU foams...then the uneducated consumer learns in time that the foam compresses and forms deep body impressions.

I like what you're doing to your Sealy mattress. If the springs are in good condition and are supportive, then I believe you can create a comfortable mattress with layers of high quality foams like latex. You are doing with your mattress what most people wouldn't even try to do because they either wouldn't think of that idea or can't be bothered buying foam and taking their mattress apart.

On the subject of warranties: They're a real joke. In many cases they make it so difficult to actually get the mattress replaced under warranty they know few people will even bother. For instance, they measure body impressions with a sting and a ruler, ignoring the fact that when you actually lie on the mattress the sag is much deeper.

The owner is responsible for getting the mattress back to the particular regional factory in which it was made. So if the store you bought it from has gone out of business or won't handle the pick up and delivery you are on your own. Or if you've moved out of state good luck with that.

To add insult to injury most standard mattress warranties are prorated. Your cost is based on the number of years you have owned the mattress and the warranty period. And not at the price you purchased the mattress, but at the so-called retail price--which is a an inflated figure the mattress is never actually sold at. It's just a way for the manufacturer to soak the customer for more money on that piece of crap they've already paid too much for.

Unless your mattress breaks down within the first year, you're better off just opening the top and replacing the foam yourself. You can swap out the low density crap inside with high quality foams for less than the manufacturer is going to charge you under their equally crappy prorated warranty.

Furthermore, on the 4 year old Sealy above, there were no indentations whatsoever in the mattress. The way they make the cover I don't think it would ever get an indentation. It isn't a matter of "indentation" it's a matter of cheap crappy foam that just gives out, gets softer than it already was, and provides less support. Foam - especially low quality foam and memory foam - tends to get way softer over time. Latex does not do this as much, hardly at all.

And good quality foam like 15 year rated Qualux HR foam that we bought for the innards of this Sealy, does not get that much softer. It may get softer, but not so much that it would stop giving support after 3-4 years. I have not tested this yet but I believe it to be true. In any case, we bought it in layers and zones so that it will be easy  and cheap to replace layers in the mid section (middle zone) if need be. That is IF we don't use latex, which we probably will, soon. Right now I'm just experimenting with ILD's of the HR foam in order to get a sense of how firm of a mid-section I want. Last night I realized that ANY sinking at all of my hip section causes me pain at this point. So I replaced the Medium over Firm with Firm over Very Firm in that section.

centralpark, no offense intended, but I can't understand why you would even consider keeping this mattress after seeing what was inside mine and reading this forum.

I guarantee you that even if your's is a better model, it will still be full of cheap crappy foam. This is apparent from your saying how it is already a little compressed in the center.

Unless you want to open it up and build your own mattress as I am doing (a valid strategy, since the springs do seem to be fine), why would you even consider keeping it, especiallly with CostCo's great return policy?

The spring system is covered by a layer of what looks like shredded, multi-colored threads with a translucent piece of batting on top (to protect the foam from being punctured I presume).  The springs seem fine though, and I can't imagine my 150lbs has worn them out much.  So I'm just going to place my 4" worth of latex toppers on top of the springs and buy a zippered mattress encasement for it all.  The mattress was getting too tall with all the latex toppers, so  I was hoping to cut it down in height a little by removing some of the foam and replacing it with latex.  The quilted mattress cover that I cut off the top also had some foam inside of it, so I'll probably save 1.5" total by removing the foam and cover which is exactly what I wanted.  My mattress is flippable (made before they went to one-sided designs), so if it's still too tall I can always take the foam and quilted cover off the bottom as well.

Glad I inspired you to cut open your Sealy. But someone else here inspired me (sorry I forget exactly who, but you know who you are and thanks!)...

I wouldn't buy the zippered case until you are sure you have the configuration you want. Right now I just cut the top mattress cover completely off of mine. I noticed that the way the buttons are embedded into the cover, it was probably not helping the pressure points and it was just another 1-2" of soft crap, so I cut it completely off. Now I'm laying right on the foam, covered only by 3 top sheets - two to protect the foam and one normal. Not having the cover on there also gives me ready access to the foam zone components (zoned layers of 25" length x 1").

I'm still trying to get the right combination. It's AMAZING how just changing one or two 1" layers makes a big difference, like changing firm over medium vs medium over firm... Or changing 1" of latex for 1" of memory foam at my shoulders... It all matters... So I'm still tweaking it. Even after I find the right configuration I think I'll still just use sheets over it instead of buying a cover because who knows when I might want to adjust it?

I really don't think covers are necessary unless you just like them, as in how it looks. As to using the mattress, having a cover is not necessary - the foam seems to stay in place without it.

Not to toot my own horn or anything, but that was me!

I'm so delighted the suggestion not only seems to be working out for you, but that your example has inspired others to go for it. I fully intend to reconstruct my own mattress eventually, and your experience has been very encouraging. I almost want to do it now, but the mattress is only 6 months old and I really can't justify tearing it apart at this point. But I know it's only a matter of time before the foam softens up and I start sinking into it. So in the meantime I'm collecting foam, like the Brylane latex topper, for when the time comes. I've already got an assortment of foams to start working with.

Please let us know what ILDs of HR foam you are using and how you end up configuring them, as well as what other kinds of foam (latex, visco) you add and what thicknesses you are building with.

Jim, Right now, I'm not sure whether I'll end up keeping this mattress or at some point dissecting it when the foam is unsupportive/uncomfortable or returning the mattress and buying a better mattress with latex. I'm really tired of mattress shopping at this point. I've been to most of the local stores, and it's all the same 'ol stuff with the PU foams. There is one local manufacturer that I want to check out to see what they do, however, I believe they use PU foam. So my mind is open to buying a mattress that can be made with traditional springs and latex for the comfort layers or buying a mattress that doesn't have much foam and adding my own topper to it. But meanwhile, I need something to sleep on. Costco will allow a return at any time, thank goodness!  

I'm glad that I've got options in mind for a mattress, but right now I need a break from mattress shopping. For the time-being, I'm trying to learn more about latex foams (I don't want to make a rushed decision).

For your mattress, perhaps you can buy a good mattress pad to put over the mattress. The mattress pad will help protect the exposed foam better than sheets, and many mattress pads are made to fit deeper mattresses.

I have some 1/2" HR foam that I picked up at Joanne's. I'm not really sure what the ILD is. Feels medium-firm. You can use it as a topper. It has more body than the average low-density egg crate type foam topper because it's a denser foam. Right now I have it under my memory foam topper where I have inserted the carpet remnant sheets, to provide additional padding there. I also have a folded over piece inside a travel pillow case that I tuck under my waist to give me more support in the lumbar region.

If you wanted to experiement you could pick some up at Joanne's. It's 50% off just about every other week. The downside is that it only comes in 24" wide lengths, but you can buy a yard or two and just tuck it directly under the spot you sleep in to see how it works out and you've only spent a few bucks. I'm narrow and don't move around much, so it works for me just fine, but if you like the feel you can take it to a foam store and ask them to match the ILD in a mattress-size piece.

I know you have allergies to PU. I can't imagine what you did before you bought your Flobed. I was actually replying to Jimsocal who was asking about HR foam as a topper material. As long as you can sleep on latex, Lynn, you already have the best bedding material available. But there is something to be said for other kinds of foam if offgassing isn't a problem. I don't think that even the best of them will last as long as latex, but they have characteristics that may work better for some people or in certain circumstances.

Ironically enough, although I wasn't terribly bothered by the smell of my memory foam toppers, the scent of LI's Taletech latex really got to me. I just couldn't seem to get the smell to go away. The more trouble I had sleeping on the mattress the more the smell bothered me. In fact it kind of made me nauseous! For weeks after I returned the mattress I would walk into the house and catch whiffs of it. It seems to be everywhere. After receiving the Brylane topper which only smells like the plastic bag, I'm more convinced than ever the smell is added to the latex and not the natural scent. Are you listening LI? Tone it down!