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Hi all,
After a short 5 years, our Simmons Beautyrest Black Exquisite mattress has large sag spots where my wife & I sleep. We've looked at new Latex Bliss mattresses and like them alot, then I came across the posts on Mattress Surgery and became curious. The bed is basically a 12" mattress with about a 4.5" firm pillow top sewn on. It's a real problem trying to find deep pocket sheets to fit! After cutting a couple of inspection holes, it looks like the mattress is (from the bottom up), 7.5" of mattress springs, 2" of foam, 1" of foam, 1/2" of some cloth/mesh material. The topper is foam with some latex in it. We really like the feel of the Latex Bliss Entice (3.0 Hybrid) & Beautiful (Natural) mattresses and would be shooting for a similar feel. So our questions are: 1) Just keeping the mattress springs, what would be some suggested latex layers & ILDs ? 2) How do you keep everything in place (zipper enclosure)?? 3) Does anyone make a Topper similar to the Entice's gel cover? We would like to bring the height of the mattress down, so any kind of latex/foam layers in the 4 - 6" range would be fine. Thanks for everyone's input! Once we get everything decided and ordered, I would be happy to post pics of the surgery for others. This message was modified Oct 12, 2012 by plasma411
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"Box springs" typically refers to the foundation unit below the mattress unit, yes? Being a Simmons, perhaps your mattress has individual coil springs? I personally do not like these and wonder if it would be troublesome covering them with Latex. But I suppose you can expect to replace existing foam with better foam. Talalay Latex comfort layers range 1", 2", 3" and 6", and 19-32 ILD. If you put 4-6" of foam on the existing 7.5 springs, you won't be reducing your mattress height, yes? Be sure you know what has failed... the existing foam... the springs... or the box spring foundation below it all, if there is one. Surgery can only fix the top comfort layers. GK |
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GKDesigns wrote: "Box springs" typically refers to the foundation unit below the mattress unit, yes?
Being a Simmons, perhaps your mattress has individual coil springs? I personally do not like these and wonder if it would be troublesome covering them with Latex. But I suppose you can expect to replace existing foam with better foam. Talalay Latex comfort layers range 1", 2", 3" and 6", and 19-32 ILD. If you put 4-6" of foam on the existing 7.5 springs, you won't be reducing your mattress height, yes? Be sure you know what has failed... the existing foam... the springs... or the box spring foundation below it all, if there is one. Surgery can only fix the top comfort layers. GK It uses Simmons Advanced Pocket Coils, with foam on top of them. The mattress height is about 16.5" right now. The bottom portion of the mattress is 12" and the top is a 4.5" sewn on pillow top. I believe the pillow top is the issue, so it's got to go. So a 7.5" plus 4-6" of latex would give us around 12" overall height. |
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Hi, I did surgery on an interlaced coil Sealy. I have 2" if 32 latex, 1" of 24, 1" of 19, and 1" of memory foam. That is fairly comfortable for side sleeping. I just cover it with a mattress pad. You may be able to keep the top fastened on one or more sides and sew or reattach it some how after you put in new foam. One problem with the pocket could is that they may shift around more. Of course the foam you use will depend on how firm you want it and how firm the coils are. Good luck!
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plasma411 wrote: The mattress height is about 16.5" right now. The bottom portion of the mattress is 12" and the top is a 4.5" sewn on pillow top. I believe the pillow top is the issue, so it's got to go. So a 7.5" plus 4-6" of latex would give us around 12" overall height. 1" cover I would wonder how long the 3.5" layer will last. I wonder how much the sewn cover stiffens the contents. Given the core coils, I would consider putting a 3" 32 ILD transition over cloth/mesh/felt over the coils. Then add comfort layers... 3" 28 or break it down to something like 2" 24, 1" 19, or 2" 28, 1" 24, or... That's the idea but I don't have the numbers for you. King size will be most expensive and likely come with glue seams. Maybe just replace the pillow top with 3" 28 or 3" 19 depending how it feels below and how much plush you want. If I tried this surgery, I would favor layers that I could migrate/bail to an all Latex build... something like 3x3" 28-36-40/44 or 3x4" 19-28-36-40/44. GK |
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GKDesigns wrote: I would wonder how long the 3.5" layer will last. I wonder how much the sewn cover stiffens the contents. Given the core coils, I would consider putting a 3" 32 ILD transition over cloth/mesh/felt over the coils. Then add comfort layers... 3" 28 or break it down to something like 2" 24, 1" 19, or 2" 28, 1" 24, or... That's the idea but I don't have the numbers for you. King size will be most expensive and likely come with glue seams. Maybe just replace the pillow top with 3" 28 or 3" 19 depending how it feels below and how much plush you want. If I tried this surgery, I would favor layers that I could migrate/bail to an all Latex build... something like 3x3" 28-36-40/44 or 3x4" 19-28-36-40/44. GK I did find out that the Bliss Beautiful bed is (from top to bottom): 3" Talalay 19 ILD Because the foam failed in the pillow top so quickly, I think we're looking at getting rid of all the foam, and starting over with Latex. The brands we're considering are Latex International (as they seem to be a trusted brand), but I noticed others have used FBM / the Foam Factor but the reviews seemed mixed. Anyone care to comment on the FBM Talalay Latex as they are considerably less expensive? |
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plasma411 wrote: Thanks GK - We're thinking along the same lines. In the end, if the surgery fails, I will ditch the coils and just add a latex base and have an all latex bed. I did find out that the Bliss Beautiful bed is (from top to bottom): 3" Talalay 19 ILD Because the foam failed in the pillow top so quickly, I think we're looking at getting rid of all the foam, and starting over with Latex. The brands we're considering are Latex International (as they seem to be a trusted brand), but I noticed others have used FBM / the Foam Factor but the reviews seemed mixed. Anyone care to comment on the FBM Talalay Latex as they are considerably less expensive? Knowing the build of LI's Pure LatexBliss mattresses could be helpful... here's what I could find... LI Pure LatexBLISS Mattress Builds v2 8" (1+6+1) Pamper, plush 5: 1" 19 ILD Talalay comfort 6" 40 ILD Talalay core 1" 50 ILD Talalay base (polyfoam in v1) Note: This mattress probably needs a topper. 10" (3+6+1) Nature, plush 8: 2" 19 ILD Talalay comfort 1" 28 ILD Talalay comfort 6" 36 ILD Talalay core 1" 50 ILD Talalay base (polyfoam in v1) 11" (4+6+1) Nutrition, plush 7: 2" 19 ILD Talalay comfort 2" 28 ILD Talalay comfort 6" 36 ILD Talalay core 1" 50 ILD Talalay base (polyfoam in v1) Note: I wonder how this mattress would compare to 4x3" 19-28-36-40/44? 12" (5+6+1) Beautiful, plush 9: 3" 19 ILD Talalay comfort 2" 24 ILD Talalay comfort 6" 36 ILD Talalay core 1" 50 ILD Talalay base (polyfoam in v1) Note: Similarly, I wonder how this mattress would compare to 4x3" 19-28-36-40/44? 12+4" (5+7+4) World's Best Bed, plush 10: 3" 19 ILD Talalay comfort 2" 24 ILD Talalay comfort 7" ? ILD Talalay core 4" ? ILD Talalay foundation LI Talatech Blended Talalay Latex ILD Scale
GK |
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Interesting info. I tried some of the Latex Bliss mattresses a year ago, but somewhat prefer latex over innersprings. But, given these specs, why would the Nature be plusher than the Nutrition? |
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mattresshound wrote: Interesting info. I tried some of the Latex Bliss mattresses a year ago, but somewhat prefer latex over innersprings. But, given these specs, why would the Nature be plusher than the Nutrition? Good question... the plushness ratings come from their website. If correct as they intend them to be, perhaps the additional 1" of 28 comfort makes the Nutrition 'feel' more firm, less plush. Or, maybe the layer specs are not 100% accurate... but this would remain to be determined by further discovery. At this point, I have fairly high confidence in the specs noted... and they 'feel' about right by my limited experience. Mattress comfort is very subjective (to individual requirements and preferences)... and melding layers of various Latex together makes the equation more complex. However, I suspect there is a not-to-difficult formula for putting Latex together to build a functional mattress... it's at least more appealing than buying a new over-priced over-built innerspring mattress in today's marketplace, imo. This formula includes comfort layers and core layers similar to those noted above... in a cover and on a flat, slatted platform that ventilates from below... plus shredded Latex pillows that you can fine tune for your mattress and your head by adding or removing gobs of shredded Latex! GK This message was modified Oct 16, 2012 by GKDesigns
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Well, I finally had time to take the pillowtop apart. There was a 1" foam piece, but the surprise was under it. A 3" Latex International 40 ILD Talalay topper! What was more surprising was to see the indentations of our bodies in the Latex. I was under the impression that Latex rebounded to its original shape. The Latex is about 5 years old, but that seems rather quick to deteriorate. I'm revisiting if I want to rebuild the mattress with Latex again. I may switch to memory foam. Any thoughts ? |
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plasma411 wrote: Well, I finally had time to take the pillowtop apart. There was a 1" foam piece, but the surprise was under it. A 3" Latex International 40 ILD Talalay topper! What was more surprising was to see the indentations of our bodies in the Latex. I was under the impression that Latex rebounded to its original shape. The Latex is about 5 years old, but that seems rather quick to deteriorate. I'm revisiting if I want to rebuild the mattress with Latex again. I may switch to memory foam. Any thoughts ? Some thoughts:
It's a mystery or just some bad Latex. GK |