| Let me start out by saying that my wife and I spent several weekends trying out king size mattresses at various mattress stores. We found several that we were happy with, but they just didn't quite do it for us, not to mention they were all well over $2000. We finally stopped at a City Mattress and loved the all latex pranasleep, except for the price tag. That was way out of our league, but that pretty much ended our mattress search since we didn't want to settle on something when we knew we loved the latex mattress. Sleep EZ seems like a great alternative, given all the great reviews on here, especially since I would prefer my side a little firmer than my wife's. However, we noticed in one of our recent Costco coupon mailers, a traditional King Sealy Posturpedic for $659, which includes the box spring. Can't beat the price, but I haven't done my research on the bed yet, so it might be a piece of garbage. For now, let's just assume the bed is a decent bed. How would adding some sort of latex topper to it compare to a 100% latex mattress? |
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I recently bought a twin latex bed set off Ebay (bear with me,lol) and it's supposed to be delivered next week but I wanted to mention the seller since it's the company that supplies the latex for Dormia, Spring Air and some others. I saw their beds on Ebay and did some checking and emailing. What I found out is that Latexco, a Belgian latex company built a latex factory in Lavonia ,Ga. in 2006. They are selling their mattresses directly on Ebay. I've seen 3 models listed there. A european, a natural and the American Luxury Plush (that's the one I bought) I emailed latexco to make sure this factory is their's(it is) and the Ebay seller is connected to them(he is). The mattresses are listed as all latex so I took a chance and ordered. Anyway, I'm mentioning it because his prices being factory direct is what sold me on it as it was by far the cheapest I could buy all latex. I haven't got the mattress yet so I can't say as to quality but since Latex International was the only supplier in the U.S. of latex till now, I figured I'd mention it since his prices might be more what you are looking for. Here's the seller: http://cgi.ebay.com/INNERGETIC-Queen-size-American-Luxury-Sleep-System_W0QQitemZ280190938499QQihZ018QQcategoryZ37647QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem Here's info about their factory: http://www.furnituretoday.com/article/CA6328856.html?display=News Here's the Latexco USA contact guy: http://www.hdboutique.com/hdboutique/3570/exhibitor_details.jsp?detailKey=19724868&eosCompanyId=257855&showCode=3570-07 Here's the Latexco site: http://www.latexco.be/ That probably seems like a lot of links but I have a sickness called research everything to death(drives the hubby crazy) and I know people on here tend to do that as well so I figured I'd share what I found out. Kimberly |
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A latex topper over an innerspring mattress will not feel like an all latex mattress. For some people with lower back problems that might actually be preferable, but it you love the feel of an all latex mattress you won't achieve that feeling by putting a latex topper over an innerspring mattress. I would caution anyone ordering a latex mattress over the internet to review the merchant's return policy very carefully. A Talalay latex mattress really has to be built up of multiple layers of different firmness, from a firm support layer to a softer comfort layer, and that's the tricky part. All latex mattresses don't feel the same. Sometimes it takes more than one exchange to get it right. Sometime you never get it right and just have to return it. Restocking fees and return shipping charges can really add up, so be aware of what you're getting into and what you're okay shelling out for. |
| While I generally agree with what cloud9 posted, as you increase the depth of the topper you obviously get closer and closer to an all latex feel. I now have roughly 5" of zoned latex in a zoned topper, where the aged firm coil mattress is essentially replacing a first support layer of firm latex. My guess is that if I instead put the 5" of topper on a 3" extra firm latex layer, it would feel roughly the same. [Note: MIne eventually will go on a 3" latex base, but that too will be zoned] |
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mccldwll wrote: While I generally agree with what cloud9 posted, as you increase the depth of the topper you obviously get closer and closer to an all latex feel. I now have roughly 5" of zoned latex in a zoned topper, where the aged firm coil mattress is essentially replacing a first support layer of firm latex. My guess is that if I instead put the 5" of topper on a 3" extra firm latex layer, it would feel roughly the same. [Note: MIne eventually will go on a 3" latex base, but that too will be zoned] I'm not sure that 5" of latex toppers will feel the same over 3" of firm latex as it does over coils. Coils have a very different kind of support than latex does. Even firm latex. Coils are rigid. Latex isn't. The coils provide additional back support and overall they support the body more evenly than latex alone. That being said, I used to sleep on a Dunlop latex mattress that was only 5" thick and was mated to a boxspring unit. I loved that mattress and still maintain that Talalay doesn't come close to Dunlop in providing comfort and support in the same core. But it occurs to me that a 5" latex mattress placed over a boxspring is probably very similar to your 5 inches of toppers over an innerspring mattress. The downside is that the innerspring mattress will start to sag long before the latex wears out and the latex will just sag into it. This message was modified Jan 23, 2008 by cloud9
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"The downside is that the innerspring mattress will start to sag long before the latex wears out and the latex will just sag into it." Not so sure about that. I've never cut open an old fashioned, minimally padded coil mattress which was considered shot, but it's my understanding that there is little, if any, degradation of the coil system. All the collapse is due to compressed foam. Further, a latex topper over coils should distribute the point loads much more evenly (i.e., less concentrated force on the springs). The coil mattress probably would last the lifetime of the latex. |
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This is exactly what my mattress guy said and demonstrated with our old coil mattresses when he picked them up. He said the springs looked brand new after 13 years. But, he couldn't say the same for the cheap foams. I think maybe in the old, old days when coil systems weren't constructed as well, you would hear more about coils popping out of the mattress. Animated cartoons were famous for this. :) But, I haven't seen anything like that, even in a less-expensive mattress. It's always been the padding that's broken down. Previous quote: Not so sure about that. I've never cut open an old fashioned, minimally padded coil mattress which was considered shot, but it's my understanding that there is little, if any, degradation of the coil system. All the collapse is due to compressed foam. Further, a latex topper over coils should distribute the point loads much more evenly (i.e., less concentrated force on the springs). The coil mattress probably would last the lifetime of the latex. quote: The downside is that the innerspring mattress will start to sag long before the latex wears out and the latex will just sag into it This message was modified Jan 23, 2008 by BeddyBye
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I guess it depends on how heavy duty the coil unit is. I would like to think that it's true the coils will last forever. But you have to wonder why mattress manufacturers would bother using coils that will last forever when the foam they put on top of the coils breaks down in about three years. In any case even if it's just the foam layer sagging on the mattress, placing a latex topper over it is only going to excentuate the sagging. |
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"In any case even if it's just the foam layer sagging on the mattress, placing a latex topper over it is only going to excentuate the sagging." This thread is not about putting a latex topper over a sagging mattress. It's about a latex topper over a coil support system instead of over a latex support system, and how long the coil system will last. In such case, not only would the latex topper not accentuate the sagging since the latex would better distribute the loads, it would help prevent sagging in the first place. However, you would need to start out with a minimally padded coil mattress. Further, while it is generally assumed that putting a latex topper over a sagging coil mattress won't help (like putting lipstick on a pig) that's not really true. While a uniform ILD topper won't work (think Princess and the Pea in reverse), a topper with extra support in the sagging section (to make up for what's broken down) will work. The easiest/cheapest way is probably extra material under the topper in the sagging area to "fill the void" (PU, camping pad, latex, whatever ). The other option is higher ILD in that broken down region, but that gets trickier (and entire topper gets thicker) since probably still want/need a softer comfort layer on top. |
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mccldwll wrote: "In any case even if it's just the foam layer sagging on the mattress, placing a latex topper over it is only going to excentuate the sagging." This thread is not about putting a latex topper over a sagging mattress. It's about a latex topper over a coil support system instead of over a latex support system, and how long the coil system will last. In such case, not only would the latex topper not accentuate the sagging since the latex would better distribute the loads, it would help prevent sagging in the first place. However, you would need to start out with a minimally padded coil mattress. Further, while it is generally assumed that putting a latex topper over a sagging coil mattress won't help (like putting lipstick on a pig) that's not really true. While a uniform ILD topper won't work (think Princess and the Pea in reverse), a topper with extra support in the sagging section (to make up for what's broken down) will work. The easiest/cheapest way is probably extra material under the topper in the sagging area to "fill the void" (PU, camping pad, latex, whatever ). The other option is higher ILD in that broken down region, but that gets trickier (and entire topper gets thicker) since probably still want/need a softer comfort layer on top.
Relating to the original post in this thread: mpb2000 - I highly recommend you NOT buy the CostCo Sealy! We were in exactly the same boat as you, except that we did not like the feel of latex, but were convinced that SOME kind of foam combination was the best idea.... In the end we got tired of experimenting (4 years ago) and bought the CostCo Sealy Fenway. It was very bouncy, but aside from that it was fairly comfortable for the first couple of years. DIdn't help my back problem much but then neither did the latex or the memory foam combinations we'd tried. However, the Sealy started feeling uncomfortable somewhere around 2 and 1/2 years in. By the 3rd year it was getting to the point where the thing was just plain uncomfortable and we started adding toppers and so forth but then we realized it was the sagging that was the problem and nothing would fix that. So if you want a bed that will be comfortable for maybe 2 years - not to mention very bouncy; moreso than most spring mattresses - buy the CostCo Sealy. Our's was the Fenway. Not sure how that compares to the one you are buying, but my guess is, a CostCo Sealy is a CostCo Sealy. If you like latex, go for latex. Look around for good prices. You might even look around the nearest big city and see if you might find a foam distributor that has it cheaper. Find out how the bed you like best is made up and make your own based on those stats. Generally speaking if it's all latex and foam or just all latex, a lot of what you are paying for is just the fancy ticking or cover, which you really don't need. You can buy things like wool toppers, and when the bed is made up you don't see the foam, anyway. You can probably have a cover sewn out of canvas or some such heavy cotton or ? material for $100 or find one at a futon shop. If money is no object, just buy a pre-made foam mattress or flo-bed or whatever. But what's nice about making your own is you can research and make it to fit your own needs, and you can make each side of the bed different for husband and wife. Make sure you try both kinds of latex. We tried all Talalay in various combinations and it did not work out for us - we returned all of them. However, we tried an Englander at the time that was made from Dunlop and it seemed the most comfortable. We did not buy it because they had no sleep trial and it was rather expensive - too expensive to try without the ability to return it. But from waht I am reading now, and based on that one bed we liked, I am convinced that this time we will experiment with Dunlop (natural) latex if we can find a good price on it. |
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I've pretty much set my mind on doing this very thing. I live near Charlotte, NC and "The Original Mattress Company" makes their own mattresses in house. They have an "Orthpopedic" mattress that is a rock solid mattress. They don't go in for this single-sided mattress gimmick either (just my opinion). The "Orthpodedic" queen size has 489 offset coils, 12 3/4 gauge with six turns and 12 year warranty. They make one that has barely any padding at all. Maybe 1 1/2" of 5.2 lb foam. I want to put a 3 or 4" latex topper on this bed and have alreadt verified that it will not void the warranty. My question is which type of latex topper? What ILD to shhot for. I have back problems, but my concern is my pressure points from being a side sleeper that bothers me the most. Shoulders, hips and even my knees hurt. I welcome all opinions and the reasoning behind them. I'm 6'0" and weigh 215 lbs. Thanks in advance for your feedback! |
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If you can find a source for reasonably priced latex toppers, try getting them in 1" thicknesses, in 2 different ILD's - say, 11 and 14, something around there. Take these 2 layers and cut them into thirds so you have a top head and shoulder section, a middle hips section and a legs-and-feet section. Then you can play with zoning them, i.e.; you can put 2 soft sections at the top and the firmer sections at the bottom 2/3. Or you can put a softer over a harder for the top and a harder over a harder for the medium, etc. etc... Use a tape measure and an electric meat carving knife to cut them. They will tend to stick together once placed on the mattress. If you have a tight top sheet or something like that, it will help keep them in place and they won't really move around. Just as an addendum to the question about springs wearing out: We bought the Sealy at Costco about 5 years ago. I tried putting foam on top of them and after awhile I realized the springs were killing me. They had worn out. After dumping them I am doing better, though I'm still looking for the perfect combination of foams. I would LOVE to try some really GOOD springs under foam but I don't know where to buy just the springs and I don't want to pay for a mattress only to tear it up and tear out the crappy foam and/or batting they put over the springs. Someone recommended buying a relatively new used mattress and taking that apart and some day I might do that. For now, I'm trying foam without springs. |
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You're right. My mattress guy showed me the inside of our old mattress and the coils were like brand new. He verified that innersprings rarely give out. It's the foam and padding inside that compresses, even more so if it's cheap. <BR><BR><BR><BR> mccldwll wrote: &quot;The downside is that the innerspring mattress will start to sag long before the latex wears out and the latex will just sag into it.&quot;<BR><BR>Not so sure about that. I've never cut open an old fashioned, minimally padded coil mattress which was considered shot, but it's my understanding that there is little, if any, degradation of the coil system. All the collapse is due to compressed foam. Further, a latex topper over coils should distribute the point loads much more evenly (i.e., less concentrated force on the springs). The coil mattress probably would last the lifetime of the latex.<BR> <BR>This message was modified Jun 23, 2009 by BeddyBye
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August59, I would recommend taking a second look at the extra rather than the ultra firm. The ultra firm to me is like sleeping on a board (and I like very firm mattresses). But, I think that it may not give enough of the benefit from a spring system. Have your salesman talk to you about the differences in the mattress (the layer over the springs are different), also if you want something slightly differen, they do cusomizaitons. I would start with the actually mattress, and then add layers of foam on 1"-1.5" at a time. You may also want to try a cuddlebed for cushion. Many people on the board likes it. There will be some trade off between back pain and shoulder discomfort, untill you can get the right mix. This is also why I recommend the extra model. I use foambymail's latex, and have 1" of each ild right now and it is working pretty good for both me and my wife. It is not perfect for me yet, but it is the best that I've found in over two years. Good luck and let us know how it works for you. |
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mpb2000 wrote: How would adding some sort of latex topper to it compare to a 100% latex mattress? Wow, lots of great discussion. But I wanted to add that if you want to feel a latex topper on a coil mattress you can go to a Dux store. Their beds are exactly this, although with some fancy bits and a high price tag. I found them to be quite comfortable although they don't have any sort of return policy so I didn't bite...Steve |
| Has anyone looked into this? I'm researching finding a well built but inexpensive AIR mattress so there is no concern with coil sag or foam sag, etc. and putting a 4" latex topper on it. To me, that might give you the best of three worlds: a bed that won't wear out for a very long time, a latex topper to give you excellent support and comfort, and both of them at a comparatively reasonable price. Certainly more affordable than the typical coil mattess with latex at 2k +. |
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fixer wrote: Has anyone looked into this? I'm researching finding a well built but inexpensive AIR mattress so there is no concern with coil sag or foam sag, etc. and putting a 4" latex topper on it. To me, that might give you the best of three worlds: a bed that won't wear out for a very long time, a latex topper to give you excellent support and comfort, and both of them at a comparatively reasonable price. Certainly more affordable than the typical coil mattess with latex at 2k +. Typical mattress construction is comfort layers over support layer(s). Typical Latex mattress construction is a 2" comfort layer over a 6" support layer, give or take a few inches. So, I would choose your Latex and air layers accordingly. Air pressure tends to vary with ambient conditions... I would guess you'd have better luck using all Latex... eventually. GK |
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Re the air mattress, I had this same BRILLIANT IDEA. The problem though was that when I researched it, I saw that the regular air mattresses have just terrible reviews and don't seem all that durable - air leaks for example. Lots of reports of beds that collapse in the night. Or slow leaks that you may not notice if you have a guest sleep on it just a few nights every now and then but you would notice if you tried to sleep on it every night. You're talking about inflatable beds, right? those ones that are about $100 and some dollars? The Comfort-Aire type air bed seemed a little bit more durable and I like dthe idea of the air bladder you could replace when it wears out..... but then you're talking $1000 plus.
So, I think if you are looking for something that won't wear out, your thinking that an air mattress is durable is actually a false premise. This message was modified May 4, 2012 by Kashkakat
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