Here is a general idea of some of their mattress constructions with and without a 2" topper http://www.mattresssave.com/index.php?mattress/shop/brand/6

The 28 ILD and the 19 ILD would probably feel quite noticeably different on a firm mattress but testing it on something "soft" may distort the results of what you are feeling. I would test them on as firm a mattress as I could (like yours) and make sure you know how thick the version you are testing is as 2" and 3" could also make a difference.

My answer to anyone who makes those kind of "definitive statements" about soft and firm is always ... for who? It's too personal IMO to make blanket judgements about ILD or what is "best". There really isn't any difference in feel between 20 - 22 and 19 ILD anyway and they seem to think that "21" is OK lol.

Phoenix

Place today had a nutritional and a sorrento and I think a nature model. I thought the 3 inch topper on the nutritional was comfortable.

  I didn't think of moving the topper to a firm bed there. I will  have to go back and try that.

Is the latex bliss topper about a 14 or 19 ild?

Phoenix

PS: you can see from the latex bliss constructions (softer over soft, thin firmer layers over soft, and different thicknesses of layers) how sophisticated their understanding of latex and layering is. This is not surprising since their "parent" company makes it. I believe it's an attempt to "show the industry" how to use latex "more correctly" and while they are more expensive than "doing it yourself" or other options (they don't want to "cut the throat" of smaller or even larger manufacturers who already understand what they do and buy their latex), it is why I believe they are "among the best" of the "national brands". With their different toppers and the different thicknesses and ILD's of their different models, they are much closer to a "make your own" approach than most (if you take only their 4 basic models and the 2 toppers, there are 12 different variations of construction). I also believe it is partly an effort to show the industry the value of using very soft latex instead of the cheap soft poly that most mattresses (including most extra firm ones) have in the very top of their construction. It's a very smart strategy IMO. They win if other major manufacturers don't copy them (they sell more Latex Bliss) and also if they do copy them (they sell more latex).

The info on Latex Bliss mattresses is very interesting, so I went out to look at their site (unfortunately it doesn't look like they are for sale in Washington?). Anyway, the thing I wanted to ask about is their "stabilization" layer. Each of their beds seem to have 1" of poly foam at the bottom, for stabilization. Do you know why they do this and what it really does? Thanks...

Steve

You can spend a lot of money very quickly once you get experimenting.

BTW there were some great deals on MF over Xmas at stores like Kohls and Bon Ton, and I think Kohls still has one running through the new years weekend.  We picked up a made-in-US    2" MF topper for $70 that normally sells for $220.

There is a lot of good information about the Pure Latex Bliss on youtube and at their blissipedia site ... but unfortunately it doesn't have any info about why they use the "stabilization layer". I believe it is to help counteract the "swaying" or "jiggly" feeling some people feel with thicker Talalay mattresses as it is less dense than Dunlop and can have more of a tendency to move a little more from "side to side" especially with a body laying on top of it. A very firm and stiff layer underneath the mattress could help counteract this and this would make sense to me. I would think it would have to be glued to the core to be most effective. A secondary benefit could be to protect the Talalay although I don't think this would have been as important in their thinking.

The only place I know of that sells them in WA is http://www.higginsonsflooringandsleepshop.com/contactus.html which is quite a ways away.

Hellbed,

Unfortunately, most of the soft latex being sold is around 20 ILD or more and this would feel much firmer than memory foam which is usually around 12-15. Of course memory foam also melts but it's usually the depth of cradling and pressure distribution that contributes to a "feeling of softness" rather than the pushback. I think a 14 ILD latex could feel similar in terms of softness except it wouldn't have the tendency of memory foam to allow certain parts to "sink too far". It will be interesting to see what happens as more 14 ILD toppers with stretchy covers "hit the market" to see how they compare with memory foam. Some of the testing that has been done in the "pressure relief" patents indicate it is slightly better even than memory foam in certain combinations (pressure relief inlays). Firmer memory foam also can feel quite hard, at least until it melts. Poly ... especially HR poly aslo has pushback (and in some cases even more than latex) and yet can feel very soft as well in the "super soft" ILD's (around 10 in some cases) or in the convoluted which "acts" softer than the ILD of the material that it was fabricated from.

Phoenix

Why is there Foam on the Bottom of a Latex Bed?

This is a great question. The answer is simple and it has to do with manufacturing the mattress.

Imagine a 200-pound sneaker that was six feet wide and six feet long. Now imagine moving that around from left to right or forwards and backwards on your dining room table. That would seem difficult right? Why? Because rubber naturally has a gripping surface. That is why they use it to grip in many applications; Tires, Sneaker soles, crutch and cane tips.

Rubber is an amazing high quality material that is not only heavy but also very difficult to move. When we build a bed, we have to move it a lot. To make it moveable, we added one inch of poly to the bottom of all of our constructions. Simply put, you can slide poly around with rubber on top of it, but you can’t move rubber by itself easily.

There is one more reason, the fire retardant cover adheres better to the poly on the bottom of the bed than it would latex. 

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So no reason those of us building our own mattresses should do the same :-)

Phoenix

I ended up ordering a 3" topper  from www.customsleepdesign.com at the beginning of January. I ordered a 3 inch 19ild so we shall see. I do hope it comes before shoulder surgery in a couple of weeks.

  I had called International Latex and that place was referred to as a dealer of their toppers also, they seemed knowledgable on the phone and very helpful.

Update 2/10  .... It has been a while but it is finally shipping YAY

I own one, and it is 1-5/8" Latex with a very nice feeling cover.  I just wanted to point out that, evidently, the 2" is including the cover thickness.  I didn't need the cover and was choosing between (both 14ILD) the PLB 2" Queen Topper at STLBeds for $299, and the 2" Queen from SLAB at $314.  I figured I'll save $15 and get a "free" cover by going with the PLB Topper.  But now I realize it wasn't as good of a deal as I thought due to the thickness difference (which can create some challenges when customizing).  However, we do love the topper.  I even doubled it over for my wife to sleep on 3-1/4" of 14ILD and she loved it (she is 5'6" and 110lbs).  But, unfortunately for her, after two nights, I had to take my side back.

Gary