Savvy Rest report
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After lurking here and other places and doing lots of research - I finally recieved my latex mattress today. I'd like to add to the discussion by sharing my experiences with a company I haven't read about on this forum and about Dunlop latex. We went with a three layer 100% DUNLOP (yes, Dunlop, not Talalay) mattress from Savvy Rest via The Natural Sleep Store. We got a queen size with split firm (ILD 40), medium (ILD 35) and soft (ILD 30) layers. The cover is made of organic cotton quilted to organic wool. The total was $1849 including shipping - more than SleepEZ or some of the other online retailers but less than other organic latex mattresses.We got free UPS shipping through The Natural Sleep Store (which would have been $219 from Savvy Rest directly) plus a gift certificate for $160.00 that could be used toward bedding at their store. So far, I really like the mattress. It is just the right firmness. I don't think we would want anything softer than this configuration. We went with Dunlop even though there is so much more information about Talalay because we were more concerned about getting something too soft rather than too firm. I'll report on how we like the mattress in a few weeks. We went from years of futons that needed to be replaced every few years so this seems extremely comfy. Our latest futon had gotten really hard so we started researching other options and finally settled on the Savvy Rest. I can't really write a full review until sleeping on the mattress for a while - but I can review the customer service. There is a huge amount of information on the Savvy Rest web site and on the Natural Sleep Store web site as well as organicmattressreviews.com. I considered SleepEZ, FloBeds, Foam Sweet Foam, Foam Source and a couple of other places and finally settled on Savvy Rest. I would have considered FloBeds if they carried Dunlop latex. My concern with SleepEZ and some of the other places was that while they described their latex in great detail, they were a little sketchy about the covers and what they used for flame retardants. I decided to narrow my search to stores that described their covers and/or had options for different covers. FloBeds had several cover choices and reasonable prices, but I really wanted natural Dunlop rather than Talalay. Both FloBeds and Savvy Rest made it clear that they didn't use chemicals in addition to the wool for fire retardant material. First, I looked at the web sites, read reviews and got samples from Savvy Rest. They seemed professional and informative. I spoke directly to a woman at Savvy Rest (can't remember her name right now) and she was very knowledgeable and told me some things that made me buy a softer mattress than I had intended to. I'm glad I took her advice. She said most of their exchanges were for softer layers and that she couldn't recommend anything firmer than medium, medium, firm - and that would be quite firm in Dunlop. She also said that the Dunlop is a bit firmer on one side than the other so you could further customize by turning one or more layer over. The side with the larger holes is firmer than the side with the smaller holes. I haven't experimented with it yet so I can't confirm if the difference is noticeable but I thought it was interesting. The mattress came in three 2x2x3 boxes which the UPS guy hauled into the house for me. They were immaculate and clearly labled on the outside with computer printed stickers and magic marker. The first box as the heaviest at 60 pounds and contained the cotton and wool cover along with the soft layer and the assembly instructions which were in a zip lock bag taped to the top of the box. The other two layers were around 53 pounds each and clearly labled in the other two boxes. Each of the half layers were in separate plastic bags and were NOT vacuum packed. They were just kind of loosely rolled and very easy to remove from the boxes. Every half layer was labled with an F, M or S.I was really impressed with the attention to detail. I called my husband to come home early to hoist the boxes up into the bedroom and help me put the bed together. It probably took us less than half an hour to put it together. I really think the split layers were easier to handle than the full layers would have been. The top of the case is thick enough that we don't feel the split - even without a mattress pad. That's enough to bore you for now. I am really happy with this purchase. It is one of the best experiences I've had buying something online. We just didn't find anything comparable locally. Cheers, Marie |
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Forgot to mention - the other selling point of this mattress is that the cotton quilted with wool top zips off completely and can be dry cleaned. It has a sturdy brass zipper and is nicely finished with bias tape. The fabric is a soft unbleached organic canvas type cotton - not the cotton damask that a lot of the mattress covers seem to have. Nor is it the "euro knit" that other manufacturers have. The top doesn't seem to "hammock" like the one in Novahelp's post below. It seems very sturdy durable but is also soft to the touch. The sides are quilted but not as thick as the top and the bottom is plain canvas without any quilting. Overall, the cover is very nicely finished. It doesn't look like a traditional mattress from a furniture store but it is nicer than a plain futon. The fit around the latex is tight but not overly tight. It was a lot easier to zip up the first time than I expected. Cheers, Marie |
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| Mattressmom, I enjoyed reading your post and please post an update on your sleeping experiences on this mattress after a week or so. It sounds like a comfortable combination of latex and with that nice cover, I have a feeling you will still love the latex bed in your next post. Thanks for sharing your experience so others will also know about Dunlap latex and other quality and reputable companies. |
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| MattressMom - congratulations on your new mattress!! And thank you for your efforts to educate and advise me on my own dilemma - you have shown me what real 'due diligence' is... I wish I had educated myself as you have prior to purchase... I cant' believe you put together your own mattress!!! |
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We still love the mattress after a couple of nights. I am REALLY glad we got the soft top layer. It is really quite firm. Most companies do call a 30 ILD a Medium or even Medium/Firm. And we did try both sides of the the pieces of latex and prefer the soft side up. I had my husband's side with the firmer side up and my side with the soft side up for a little while to see if we could tell the difference. There was a slight difference but enough to bother making both sides with the soft side up. We left the bottom firm layer with the firm side up and put the soft side up for the middle and top layers. I don't know if Talalay is like this - but the Dunlop has sort of a skin or “crust” like bread around the uncut surfaces. The softer side is like the inside of the loaf of Wonderbread while the firmer side is the side with a soft crust. The Dunlop isn't as “jiggly” or “bouncy” as the Talatech we tried locally. If we hadn't liked the soft Dunlop on the top, we would have swapped it out for a layer of blended Talatech. I would think the Dunlop under the Talatech would have dampened the bounciness of the Talatech a bit. My husband likes the mattress as is. He zonked right out last night. I could see how a topper of a 2 inch layer of fairly soft Talatech would make it even comfier for side sleeping but I'm going to leave it alone for a least a month before tweaking it. So far so good. We are sleeping directly on the mattress with just a sheet and no mattress pad at this point. We can feel the latex itself but the wool and cotton top of the mattress is thick enough that it almost feels like the wool topper we had been using before. I wish I could go down the street and test these customizable latex mattresses and toppers. You have to guess so much with a purchasing latex online. The feedback and information on this forum has been incredibly helpful. Thank you all!!! GDY55, I think a lot of people have had the same experience you had in shopping for a mattress. When I was shopping for a mattress locally, I heard all kinds of contradictory things. Mattress shopping was even worse than car shopping and the car salesmen seemed to know more about their products. All of the latex mattresses we looked at locally had a latex core with other stuff around it. No one could really tell me what. Most of the mattresses - latex or not - had some type of topper or layer over the main layer so it was hard to tell what the “core” felt like or how the topper layer would hold up. The Sealy and Stearns & Foster mattresses were nice on the outside but the latex was a new all synthetic version that doesn’t have much of a track record - and I figured that out from internet research. The sales people didn’t have a clue. After a day of mattress shopping, I was so confused I had to go the internet to piece together some kind of independent opinion. I found the SleepEZ and the Savvy Rest web pages to be the most informative. We really went back and forth between the two companies. In the end, we decided to go for the more expensive cover. That was the only difference - the latex is the same from both companies. We will probably buy a two layer medium/soft mattress from SleepEZ for my son soon if we can confirm that they don't use fire retardant chemicals. Marie This message was modified Jan 12, 2008 by mattressmom
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After two weeks on the Savvy Rest bed, we are still very happy with it. We played around with the layers a bit to fine tune it and experiment - but we ended up prefering the original soft over medium over Firm configuration. We found that the two different firmnesses on each side of each layer to make a pretty significant difference - a bigger difference than we thought at first. We ended up with the soft side up on all three layers of my side - soft over medium over firm (lower case letters for the soft side up) while my husband kept the firm side up on the bottom firm layer soft over medium over Firm (upper case letters for the firm side up) - so my side is slightly but noticebly softer than his side. We were really surprised by how much difference it made to simply put the soft side up on the bottom layer. We experimented with having medium over medium over Firm on my husband's side and soft over soft over Firm on my side for a few days - but it was a little too firm for him and just a bit too soft for me. Although I liked the softer feel of sinking in deeper for a while, my back does better with a bit more support in the middle layer. It was also a little strange to have his side of the bed so much firmer than mine. We could have reconfigured with these six firmnessesand six pieces of latex forever but I think we got it just right for us without sending any layers back and forth. It almost seems like we had more options with the Dunlop than we would have with the Talalay. Getting the split layers was definitely the way to go. I found it really easy to move all the layers around. |
Re: Savvy Rest report
| Mattressmom, Thanak for the update and letting us know that you love the Dunlap Latex and that Savvy Rest is a good place to buy a latex bed with many options also in configuration of their bed. How many exchanges of the latex cores do you get and what is the return policy? I love that you have more combinations due to the Dunlap latex having two sides. What are the ILD of your latex cores. I know that my Extra Firm for my FloBed is a Firm at SleepEZ. I wonder if your soft, medium, firm would be a medium, firm, extra firm at FloBeds? I am so glad you are satified and we all appreciate your updates. Your positive feedback will give others more options with Savvy Rest another good contender for a latex bed. |
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Savvy Rest told me the ILDs were around 30 for Soft, 35 for Medium and 40 for Firm. The directions said to put the soft side up so I think the firm side ILDs might be a bit higher. I read in several places that the Firm would feel like a rock and that Medium/Medium/Firm was the absolute firmest configuration they would recommend. I'm really glad we got the Soft layer. They really could have called the layers Medium/Firm/Extra Firm. Their Soft Dunlop isn't nearly as soft as the Soft Dunlop on other web sites. Shawn at SleepEZ said their Dunlop ILDs were 28 for Soft, 36 for Medium, 42 for Firm and 44+ for Extra Firm. I would think the SleepEZ version is a lot like the Savvy Rest except for the cover and the price. SleepEZ doesn't mention that there are different firmnesses but I think that is a characteristic of Dunlop latex because it is settles more densely in the bottom of the mold. I think the ILD estimates are not as exact as they are for Talalay. Savvy Rest will switch out the layers but you have to pay the shipping both ways - which could get pricey because of the oversized boxes. They don't vacuum pack their latex for some reason. I think you could exchange one of the half layers which would be cheaper. I didn't look into layer switching very much. Savvy Rest really tries to help you get the right configuration the first time. The only thing we might have done differently would have been to consider getting the two layer six inch version. I think we probably could have gotten away with a Soft over Soft on my side and Soft over Medium on my husband's side. I don't think the deep layering of different firmnesses is as necessary with the Dunlop as it sounds like it is with the Talalay. SleepEZ has the 8500 mattress which is two three inch layers with another half layer - which would probably be more than enough too. Other places like mattresses.net and foamorder.com sell six inch cores of Dunlop with a two inch layer of softer Dunlop on top. Now that I know what the latex feels like - that configuration makes a lot of sense to me. The six inch cores used to be standard - that's what my parents have had for years. |
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| Mattressmom, Thank you for sharing so much. Your configuration of your bed sounds like a little firmer than FloBed's soft (theirs is 28 I think) over Extra Firm (theirs is 36 ILD ont he average) over not quite as firm as their 44 Super Firm ILD. Your combination sounds comfortable. I Like that they have a 40 ILD latex core since I wish I had a 36 ILD over a 40 ILD over a 44 ILD. One of my 36 ILD latex cores averages 39 so I guess I do now have this combination and will try it out tonight. I love having so many latex cores to move around to get it just right for me. But I am glad you got it right the first time. Thanks again for educating us about another good place to buy a latex bed one is sure what latex configurations they want. I know it would have been costly for me since I would have had to exchange at least 2 latex cores. |
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Mattressmom, ,thanks for your reports and observations. I am researching what to buy and try for a new foam mattress. I am glad to hear your positive experience with Dunlop latex because although we did not like Talalay latex, I think the natural Dunlop might be more to our liking, and I like that it has 2 variable densities. What do you think about a 4" core of Dunlop with a 2" memory foam on top? Or a 2" super soft Talalay on top? This is what I am thinking of trying... |
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jimsocal wrote: Mattressmom, ,thanks for your reports and observations. I am researching what to buy and try for a new foam mattress.</p><p>I am glad to hear your positive experience with Dunlop latex because although we did not like Talalay latex, I think the natural Dunlop might be more to our liking, and I like that it has 2 variable densities.</p><p>What do you think about a 4" core of Dunlop with a 2" memory foam on top? Or a 2" super soft Talalay on top? This is what I am thinking of trying... I can only really speak from my experience so far. I don't like the feel of memory foam or Talalay latex so I wouldn't choose either of them but it might work for you with fairly firm latex underneath. I'm not sure that it is as important to layer different firmnesses of Dunlop the way they do with Talalay. A six inch layer of the ILD you prefer would probably be fine - with or without a topper layer. I like an ILD of around 30-32 in Dunlop. ***One very important note about getting naked latex is to be sure you cover it on all eight sides immediately. Exposure to sunlight will make it break it down pretty quickly.*** I've seen Dunlop (sometimes called "natural" to distinguish it from blended Talalay) at the following places. I have only heard of these places on this forum and have no direct experience with any of them. All of the web sites have interesting information. http://www.sleepez.com/latex-mattresses.htm http://www.mattresses.net/lafoma.html http://www.foamorder.com/latex.html http://www.foamsweetfoam.com/ We got a six inch twin size piece of Dunlop in ILD 32 from this vendor in Iowa for my 13 year old daughter. They drop shipped the vacuum packed latex directly from the supplier in California in about a week. So far, so good. It seems just right for her with a zippered cotton cover, mattress pad and sheet. http://organicselections.com/catalog/index.php?cPath=127_41 |
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Lynn2006 wrote: Mattressmom, Thank you for sharing so much. Your configuration of your bed sounds like a little firmer than FloBed's soft (theirs is 28 I think) over Extra Firm (theirs is 36 ILD ont he average) over not quite as firm as their 44 Super Firm ILD. Your combination sounds comfortable. I Like that they have a 40 ILD latex core since I wish I had a 36 ILD over a 40 ILD over a 44 ILD. One of my 36 ILD latex cores averages 39 so I guess I do now have this combination and will try it out tonight. I love having so many latex cores to move around to get it just right for me. But I am glad you got it right the first time. Thanks again for educating us about another good place to buy a latex bed one is sure what latex configurations they want. I know it would have been costly for me since I would have had to exchange at least 2 latex cores. You might have had better luck with some firm Dunlop. It feels denser and firmer overall than Talalay - and less bouncy. It is hard to describe the difference. I've heard the difference described as Talalay is more like Angel Food cake while Dunlop is more like Pound cake. I'm not sure you can compare their ILDs directly. 36 over 40 over 44 sounds really hard to me - but it sounds like it works for you. The woman at Savvy Rest said she had back problems (slipped disk, I think) and she used medium over medium over firm (35/35/40) and wouldn't recommend anything much firmer than that - and only if you had serious back problems. She steered us toward the Soft/Medium/Firm combo instead of M/M/F I had originally decided on. My husband needed something firmer than I liked. He could have put the firmer layers toward the top if he had needed to. In the end, he found the soft/medium/Firm combo firm enough and still very comfortable. Our only complaint is that it's hard to get up in the morning. We're too comfy... |
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Jim, We bought a Dunlop latex mattress that was a 6 inch core with just a bit of quilting/padding. It was supposedly 36 ILD and we found it neither firm enough to be supportive, nor soft enough to relieve pressure points (me: 125 Lb; him: 150 Lb). We tried adding 2 inches of memory foam which solved the pressure point issue, but made the support (or lack thereof) worse. It was altogether too squishy and killing our backs so we ended it up exchanging it for a firm-ish innerspring which has great support but needs a topper as soon as I can decide on how soft we should go... Maybe 4 inches of a single density wouldn't feel as squishy as 6 inches, but most people here seem to have a firm layer in the mix to get the needed support. |
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kimmcgov wrote: Jim,<BR><BR>We bought a Dunlop latex mattress that was a 6 inch core with just a bit of quilting/padding. It was supposedly 36 ILD and we found it neither firm enough to be supportive, nor soft enough to relieve pressure points (me: 125 Lb; him: 150 Lb). We tried adding 2 inches of memory foam which solved the pressure point issue, but made the support (or lack thereof) worse. It was altogether too squishy and killing our backs so we ended it up exchanging it for a firm-ish innerspring which has great support but needs a topper as soon as I can decide on how soft we should go... <BR><BR>Maybe 4 inches of a single density wouldn't feel as squishy as 6 inches, but most people here seem to have a firm layer in the mix to get the needed support. What did you have under the latex? We have the Savvy Rest mattress on a very solid futon platform with 1x4's about one inch apart. My daughter's mattress is on an antique iron bed with a piece of plywood and an old, very flat futon. Two three inch layers of 35 ILD over a layer of 40 ILD were too firm for me - not a bit squishy. I wonder if you really had a 36 ILD piece of latex. It should have been pretty firm according to the web sites I have seen. |
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| We have the same set-up as you: platform bed with 1 x 4 slats 1 inch apart. The frame also has two pieces of wood running length-wise to support the slats in the middle -- so a solid set up. Of course, I can't verify the ILD of the latex, it's just what we were told, so it very well could have been softer. It wasn't a zip-off cover, so we couldn't look. What I have learned from this whole thing is that comfort is so subjective and unfortunately only personal trial and error will get you to what works. It's helpful though to read detailed information like your posts. I'm glad that you are getting the good night's sleep that we all strive for and deserve... |
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kimmcgov wrote: unfortunately only personal trial and error will get you to what works. Yup. That's what makes it so hard to order something like this online without the opportunity to try it. Even the 15 minute trials in the store don't guarentee you will like a mattress once you get it home. I guess we got lucky. |
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I like that you said it didn't feel as bouncy. Would I be able to get an XL Twin Dunlop in medium around 2" thick? Or does it have to be a lot thicker? I remember laying on a Dunlopillo mattress that my mattress guy had on the floor. It definitely felt firmer...almost like a "thud" when I laid on it, compared to a "boing" of the talalay. Maybe this is what I need to put over my springs to have the best of both worlds. mattressmom wrote: You might have had better luck with some firm Dunlop. It feels denser and firmer overall than Talalay - and less bouncy. It is hard to describe the difference. I've heard the difference described as Talalay is more like Angel Food cake while Dunlop is more like Pound cake. I'm not sure you can compare their ILDs directly.<BR><BR>36 over 40 over 44 sounds really hard to me - but it sounds like it works for you. The woman at Savvy Rest said she had back problems (slipped disk, I think) and she used medium over medium over firm (35/35/40) and wouldn't recommend anything much firmer than that - and only if you had serious back problems. She steered us toward the Soft/Medium/Firm combo instead of M/M/F I had originally decided on. My husband needed something firmer than I liked. He could have put the firmer layers toward the top if he had needed to. In the end, he found the soft/medium/Firm combo firm enough and still very comfortable.<BR><BR>Our only complaint is that it's hard to get up in the morning. We're too comfy... |
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BeddyBye wrote: I like that you said it didn't feel as bouncy. Would I be able to get an XL Twin Dunlop in medium around 2" thick? Or does it have to be a lot thicker? I remember laying on a Dunlopillo mattress that my mattress guy had on the floor. It definitely felt firmer...almost like a "thud" when I laid on it, compared to a "boing" of the talalay. Maybe this is what I need to put over my springs to have the best of both worlds. The Dunlop definitely thuds rather than boings. I found there so much latex information tilted toward Talalay that I sought out places that specialized in Dunlop. I had good luck with this vendor. They told me they usually order medium in 32 ILD but they could order other ILDs for you. They do sell 2" and 3" Twin XL toppers. The prices for soft, medium and firm are somewhat different. Firmer latex costs a bit more. If you call their toll free number, be sure to ask for the person who is knowledgeable about latex - one of the owners. I think her name is Loni. This is a smallish business in Iowa but they drop ship their latex from California. Natural Selections & Organic Selections.com http://organicselections.com/catalog/index.php?cPath=127_41 1-888-216-9917 For the record, I am not a stickler about "organic" or "natural" products but I do appreciate the care taken in choosing components and product lines by the vendors who strive to sell more natural products. I appreciate the idea of "natural" products but I don't necessarily buy the hype. |
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mattressmom wrote: The Dunlop definitely thuds rather than boings. I found there so much latex information tilted toward Talalay that I sought out places that specialized in Dunlop. I had good luck with this vendor. They told me they usually order medium in 32 ILD but they could order other ILDs for you. They do sell 2" and 3" Twin XL toppers. The prices for soft, medium and firm are somewhat different. Firmer latex costs a bit more. If you call their toll free number, be sure to ask for the person who is knowledgeable about latex - one of the owners. I think her name is Loni. This is a smallish business in Iowa but they drop ship their latex from California. Natural Selections & Organic Selections.com http://organicselections.com/catalog/index.php?cPath=127_41 1-888-216-9917 For the record, I am not a stickler about "organic" or "natural" products but I do appreciate the care taken in choosing components and product lines by the vendors who strive to sell more natural products. I appreciate the idea of "natural" products but I don't necessarily buy the hype.
Glad to hear you say that. That is exactly how I would describe it as well, so that really verifies for me that although we did not like the Talalay mattress we tried from flo-beds a few years ago, we might still like latex in the Dunlop variety. Actually the first latex I ever layed on was Dunlop and it felt good, but then everyone said how greaet Talalay was so I bought into the hype. I'm not saying it isn't good, I'm just saying maybe Dunlop is better for ME. Thanks for the report and for the link. I'm going to check this company out. |
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mattressmom wrote: After lurking here and other places and doing lots of research - I finally recieved my latex mattress today. I'd like to add to the discussion by sharing my experiences with a company I haven't read about on this forum and about Dunlop latex. We went with a three layer 100% DUNLOP (yes, Dunlop, not Talalay) mattress from Savvy Rest via The Natural Sleep Store. We got a queen size with split firm (ILD 40), medium (ILD 35) and soft (ILD 30) layers. The cover is made of organic cotton quilted to organic wool. The total was $1849 including shipping - more than SleepEZ or some of the other online retailers but less than other organic latex mattresses.We got free UPS shipping through The Natural Sleep Store (which would have been $219 from Savvy Rest directly) plus a gift certificate for $160.00 that could be used toward bedding at their store. So far, I really like the mattress. It is just the right firmness. I don't think we would want anything softer than this configuration. We went with Dunlop even though there is so much more information about Talalay because we were more concerned about getting something too soft rather than too firm. I'll report on how we like the mattress in a few weeks. We went from years of futons that needed to be replaced every few years so this seems extremely comfy. Our latest futon had gotten really hard so we started researching other options and finally settled on the Savvy Rest. Mattressmom, I'm intrigued by your report on Savvy Rest. It's now been a couple months, are you just as happy now with your new mattress? I see you got soft | medium | firm. I'm looking to buy a ("Full/Std" size) Dunlop mattress for my Mom. She's 80, a side sleeper, and weighs only about 105 lbs. Based on the Savvy Rest mattress questionaire (http://www.savvyrest.com/helpful-info/mattress-questionnaire/index.php) and what the women at http://www.tinybirdsorganics.com/northstarbeds/organic-mattress-latexrubber.html write ("My sister and I both like the soft-soft-medium layering best for ourselves (we are in the 100-150 lb range and suffered from back-aches in the past when we used innerspring mattresses") I was thinking maybe soft | soft | medium might be right for my Mom, considering that soft Dunlop is firmer than soft Talalay. My other choice would be a SleepEz mattress, which is less expensive. Like you, though, I'm a bit concerned at the lack of info about their cover. Plus, although they offer Dunlop during the checkout process, they clearly favor Talalay, whereas I'm leaning towards Dunlop. The Savvy Rest emphasis on organic is nice, btw, but my Mom is not allergic nor (as far as I know) hypersensitive to chemicals. Are you totally satisfied after two months? Do you think the Savvy Rest was worth the extra expense? Philly888 This message was modified Mar 27, 2008 by Philly888
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| Having gone down that road myself I can't stress enough the importance of buying from a merchant that allows more than one comfort exchange and no restocking fee, neither of which SleepEZ does. They have a very nice product at a very attractive price but it's a crap shoot and if it doesn't work out after the first comfort exchange you are out a lot of money. Be very sure of exchange and return policies before you order. |
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cloud9 wrote: Having gone down that road myself I can't stress enough the importance of buying from a merchant that allows more than one comfort exchange and no restocking fee, neither of which SleepEZ does. They have a very nice product at a very attractive price but it's a crap shoot and if it doesn't work out after the first comfort exchange you are out a lot of money. Be very sure of exchange and return policies before you order.
Mattressmom in this thread was very persuasive about Dunlop and Savvy Rest, but Lynn2006 was ultimately more persuasive towards Flobeds. I really don't think my Mom will want to do any exchanges, but I like having the assurance that I could if I wanted to at low cost. Lynn2006 is probably closer to my Mom in height and weight than most of the other posters, and she (Lynn2006) prefers Talalay. I'm still not sure what I want for myself, and I've spent more than I've planned on my Mom's mattress, so I'm going to try to get by with a $65 topper. One crap shoot at a time. Philly888 This message was modified Mar 31, 2008 by Philly888
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Since your mom prefers Talalay she should really enjoy her Flobeds mattress. And it's reassuring that she can get those comfort exchanges if she needs them--or even return the bed for a full refund if it does come to that. I visited the Savvy Rest site and it seems like they give you one comfort exchange and do not accept returns at all! I would never buy something as expensive and personal as a mattress without having test driven it first if I knew I couldn't return it if it wasn't right for me. I think that's a terrible policy for any online mattress merchant to have. Mattressmom was really lucky it worked out for her. |
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cloud9 wrote: Since your mom prefers Talalay she should really enjoy her Flobeds mattress. And it's reassuring that she can get those comfort exchanges if she needs them--or even return the bed for a full refund if it does come to that. I visited the Savvy Rest site and it seems like they give you one comfort exchange and do not accept returns at all! I would never buy something as expensive and personal as a mattress without having test driven it first if I knew I couldn't return it if it wasn't right for me. I think that's a terrible policy for any online mattress merchant to have. Mattressmom was really lucky it worked out for her.
The reason I was leaning towards Dunlop was because of all the comfort exchanges of Talalay I've seen being discussed here, and because Dunlop has been described as being less pushy, less bouncy, and more like polyurethane foam. And I was interested in a Savvy Rest Dunlop mattress because Mattressmom was so happy with hers. But their no return policy along with the premium price were a concern. SleepEZ has the best price by far and offers Dunlop. Novahelp's dissatisfaction with his SleepEZ 10000 worried me, although what he got was Talalay (another reason I wanted Dunlop) and at 6'5" he's built nothing like my 105lb mother. Novahelp's troubles repacking and returning layers also was a concern. Lastly, when I called SleepEZ, I got a salesman who seemed disinterested (he sounded sleepy). Flobeds' salesman was wide awake and spent a lot of time on the phone with me. Lynn2006 is a good advocate for Flobeds, and very importantly she's close in size and weight to my mother. On the other hand, the multiple multiple exchanges she's discussed was a double-edged sword: it convinced me of Flobeds' excellent customer service and layer exchange policy, but it made me worry all the more about Talalay ... and that's all Flobeds offers. And I know my Mom will not be keen on the idea of doing an exchange or return, no matter what, so it's important to get it right on the first throw of the dice. But Lynn2006's situation is different in that she had an accident that put her in a lot of pain and made her particularly sensitive. My Mom is 80, has a sore knee, and recently had sciatica but still is relatively happy sleeping on her 30-year-old polyurethane Sears mattress. So it was a difficult decision on what to get for my mother. As I've written elsewhere, learning that Flobeds offers split cores on a Full/Std, something others offer only on Queen and King size, was a big deal. And the clincher was the sale on the Flobeds "zone-on-point" that's recommended for side sleepers. Split cores, zone-on-point, free layer exchanges, no restocking fee for a total return (just shipping) ... these factors give me a lot of options for configuring my Mom's bed and made me give up the desire for Dunlop. Besides, maybe Talalay is the best for my Mom after all. Neither she nor I have tested them, so what do we know? Talalay has seemingly been dissed in this forum lately, but Lynn2006 isn't the only person here who's happy with it. Talalay is favored by many mattress makers, and not because it's any cheaper to make (I believe the opposite is true). If Dunlop was better, and cheaper to make than Talalay, Flobeds and SleepEZ and many others would be pushing Dunlop. And they're not. Philly888 This message was modified Mar 31, 2008 by Philly888
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I laid on two of the most comfortable 100% talalay mattresses by Serta the other day. They are a new line and if I didn't already have my zippered mattress I would highly consider one. There was an 8" talalay latex core and it felt very supportive without being pushy or bouncy. It had a nice quilted cover, too. Anyway, I liked the feel of it. Philly888 wrote: It's Lynn2006 who prefers Talalay - she has a Flobeds Talalay mattress, and she bought a Dunlop topper and returned it and got a Talalay topper. I don't know what my mother prefers. I know it's not inner spring, because it's been 50 years or more since she had an inner spring mattress and she's said she doesn't want inner spring. She's been sleeping on a Sears-o-pedic polyurethane mattress for the past 30 years, so I suspect she can sleep on anything.</p><p>The reason I was leaning towards Dunlop was because of all the comfort exchanges of Talalay I've seen being discussed here, and because Dunlop has been described as being less pushy, less bouncy, and more like polyurethane foam. And I was interested in a Savvy Rest Dunlop mattress because Mattressmom was so happy with hers. But the no return policy along with the premium price were a concern.</p><p>SleepEZ has the best price by far and offers Dunlop. Novahelp's dissatisfaction with his SleepEZ 10000 worried me, although what he got was Talalay (another reason I wanted Dunlop) and at 6'5" he's built nothing like my 105lb mother. Novahelp's troubles repacking and returning layers also was a concern. Lastly, when I called SleepEZ, I got a salesman who seemed disinterested (he sounded sleepy). Flobeds' salesman was wide awake and spent a lot of time on the phone with me.</p><p>Lynn2006 is a good advocate for Flobeds, and very importantly she's close in size and weight to my mother. On the other hand, the multiple multiple exchanges she's discussed was a double-edged sword: it convinced me of Flobeds' excellent customer service and layer exchange policy, but it made me worry all the more about Talalay ... and that's all Flobeds offers. And I know my Mom will not be keen on the idea of doing an exchange or return, no matter what, so it's important to get it right on the first throw of the dice. But Lynn2006's situation is different in that she had an accident that put her in a lot of pain and made her particularly sensitive. My Mom is 80, has a sore knee, and recently had sciatica but still is relatively happy sleeping on her 30-year-old polyurethane Sears mattress.</p><p>So it was a difficult decision on what to get for my mother. As I've written elsewhere, learning that Flobeds offers split cores on a Full/Std, something others offer only on Queen and King size, was a big deal. And the clincher was the sale on the Flobeds "zone-on-point" that's recommended for side sleepers. Split cores, zone-on-point, free layer exchanges, no restocking fee for a total return (just shipping) ... these factors give me a lot of options for configuring my Mom's bed and made me give up the desire for Dunlop. Besides, maybe Talalay is the best for my Mom after all. Neither she nor I have tested them, so what do we know? Talalay has seemingly been dissed in this forum lately, but Lynn2006 isn't the only person here who's happy with it. Talalay is favored by many mattress makers, and not because it's any cheaper to make (I believe the opposite is true). If Dunlop was better, and cheaper to make than Talalay, Flobeds and SleepEZ and many others would be pushing Dunlop. And they're not.</p><p>Philly888 |
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| Hi Mattressmom--are you still out there? If so, I'd love to hear how you are doing with your mattress. I'm figuring you're probably still happy, because if you weren't, I'm sure you'd be posting! Either way, if you're still out there, please post an update. I'm considering a Savvyrest, but am also quite concerned about their return policy and warranty. |
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For what it's worth.. I called Sleep EZ (spoke to a Shawn, dunno if it's the same Shawn everybody here talks about... I will assume so), regarding how they handle flame retardants. The answer was "we use (indiscernable thru my phone) wool." Shawn said there was not a need to add flame retardant because the wool material they used was naturally flame retardant. Thoughts? By the way... thank you so much MattressMom for all your posts! It finally put all these things I've heard and read about in an understandable format. Be great to hear from you on how things are going with your Savvy Rest now that it's been a bit longer :) Oh yeah.. just heading out the door to do an in-store test drive of a Savvy Rest myself :) Richiro P.S. Oh.. to Philly. I don't necessarily think we can conclude which is better based on what most vendors are "pushing" (in the talaly vs dunlop debate). They could be pushing one over the other for a number of reasons (manufacturer incentives to retailers, markup ability, supply/deman (aka what customers seem more willing to pay more for), etc.). After all, there in business for a reason. :) This message was modified Feb 12, 2009 by richiro
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| It's true. Wool is a natural flame retardant barrier material. Most of the major manufacturers use barrier materials rather than dusting the mattresses with chemicals like boric acid. |
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OH... just one other thing I found out when I called Sleep EZ. On their webiste, and per Shawn on the phone, Sleep EZ is now offering a 90-day return policy along with its 90-day exchange policy. Per Shawn, the return policy was a shipping cost return policy (no re-stocking fees). The competition heats up I guess huh? After spending an hour at a Savvy Rest store the other night, I wanted to just offer my .02 on some of the things being debated on this thread, and some things I learned along the way: 1. Definitely find a store to try a mattress out first-hand (even if it's a competitor's store). Not only will you have a real-life reference to use in your decisions, but for me I realized that I'm not as worried about return policies or exchanges as much as I was prior to the store visit. I basically have it narrowed down to what I want, and am pretty sure I won't have to return anything (although I don't like the idea of "no return policy"). And just in my case, I just saved myself a huge headache and tons of additional hours of research because I now know I'm only interested in dunlop. 2. Phones calls phone calls phone calls! I hate being on/using the phone myself and prefer to read/research online. However a 15 min phone call (if at that) allowed me to find out that Sleep EZ in fact now has a 90-day return policy, and allowed me to find out the elusive information regarding flame retardants on their covers. A total of 3 quick calls also landed me "organic certifications" and mattress material listings and even "chemical analyses" for the products of 2 of the 3 vendors I'm considering (the 3rd vendor, turns out, doesn't have such documentation ~ interesting indeed). 3. Talalay and Dunlop are extremely different. Definitely research and make an informed decision on this (obviously I recommend going to a store to help decide this). It makes complete sense now to me why talalay customers are constantly swapping and experimenting to get the right feel. It also sold me on the idea of layers and going for split-layered mattress. 4. I don't know about depending so much on stats (e.g. ILD's) and other attempts to "standardize" what should work for this or that body frame and weight. I think sleeping comfort is far too personal and subjective for it to be that simple. For instance, I took Savvy Rest's "comfort questionare" at which point they kicked out recommendations on mattress configurations. Turns out my favorite confiruation in-store wasn't any of those recommendations. The questionnare results didn't even suggest the standard firm-med-soft configuration which i found to be pretty spot on for me. To take it a step further, I experimented out of curiosity and tried firm-soft-med which nobody recommends and is very unconventional ~ but it seemed to feel even MORE comfy that way to me. Point is, nothing beats going in person (even if it's to try similar products just to get an idea). Now if only I can convince 1 vendor to incorporate all the "good parts" about the 3 vendors total I'm considering ~ I'd be in heaven! Good luck to everybody... Hope something I said was helpful. Richiro |
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Ricchiro, I found out what I find comfortable in a store for the first hour may not be that comfortable after sleeping on it for a night. This was my experience buying a conventional mattress that were perfect in the store but caused me allergies in my closed bedroom and hurt my back so much. Also the softer latex combinations with my FloBed felt the best for the 1st hour and then in the morning my back hurt so I kept going firmer and firmer with a thinner topper over the very firm latex cores that seemed to work for me and have me sleep well and wake up hating to get out of bed. Hence, make sure where ever you buy a mattress, you have a return or exchange policy. Good luck and please keep us updated. |
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Lynn.. Great point. I'm just excited that I feel much more confident that it's all going to be fine. I am definitely still going back n forth about the 90-day return/exchange vendor vs the 90-day exchange-only vendor for that very reason you mentioned. Especially when the "exchange-only" vendor is the more expensive vendor. But I know the customer support is excellent with that more expensive vendor and just seeing the product myself vs some of the things i've heard with the other vendor, I can see myself going with the "exchange-only" more expensive vendor because I'm pretty convinced at this point they have the higher quality product. But dang.. $500 more and no returns (just exchanges?) That's tough to justify also. *sigh* Richey |
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| Richiro, Who only has a 90 day exchange policy only? I know FloBeds lets you exchange cores up to 90 days but also return everything if it is within the 90 days or at least that is how it was when I bought my mattress. Is it the store you like that is local? Maybe you can ask them if they will let you have a special deal in returning everything in 90 days in writing? I would have never tried a mattress online if I would have been stuck with it if it was not comfortable for me no matter how I tried. I am glad I tried and exchanged cores and kept my FloBed. I learned my lessen with my awful Sealy Posteurpedic bed that was always way too firm for even me with no padding at all but I dealt with it for years until the bed's springs broke down and my platform bed broke. |
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I will have to echo Lynn's post - a mattress in the store might feel very good but might also be too soft for the long run. It happened to me... That's what got me here to this forum. You can always soften up a too firm mattress, but it's very difficult to go the other way. Beware of thinking that one retailer has some magical higher quality product. This is just not the case. They all get the stuff from one or two manufacturuers. There is a tremendous amount of hype in this business. What you are mostly getting from the retailers is service and the fact that they are 'there" if something happens. The two that are mentioned mostly on this forum have shown that they are reliable and honest from what I've been able to tell. Paying way more money than what they are asking for their beds doesn't seem prudent to me. On the other end of the spectrum, if you do your homework and are a risktaker, you can DIY and save about 1/2 the cost of retail. Bill |
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Firstly, FloBeds is out for me because I want Dunlop. So that leaves 3 vendors I have been considering: Savvy Rest, Sleep EZ, and Habitat Futons. Savvy Rest is both the most expensive, and the only vendor that doesn't accept returns (90-day exchange only). Also been in business the least amount of time (although the people and customer service and documentation are excellent). Sleep EZ is the cheapest with a 90-day exchange and return policy. I think they have been in the business the longest, but I ruled them out for me (they were the only one of the three that couldn't provide materials documentation on their product, they've said some different things about synthetic vs natural, and talalay vs dunlop then i've read from a few other sites). Habitat Futons is the middle in pricing (more towards Sleep EZ then Savvy Rest) and has a 180 day return policy. They've been in business the 2nd longest. Only vendor that doens't use re-configurable layers. I'm at this point waiting for the Savvy Rest rep to get back to me on how close she can come to the competitor's price to sway me into going with Savvy Rest first. Thanks again to everybody for all their help! Richiro P.S. What recommendations do you have for vendors if one wants to DIY? This message was modified Feb 18, 2009 by richiro
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| Richiro -- Foamorder.com has dunlop... it's under the name Natural Sense. They have all types of options for DIY-ers, but I'm not sure about return policy. Don't forget to check out the clearance section. http://www.foamorder.com/latex.php |
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MattressMom, So I was just curious if you were still around and how your Savvy Rest is working out a few months later? Would enjoy hearing more stories/reviews about mattresses after people have had them a while. FYI. I've decided to go with Savvy Rest and it should be here in a couple weeks. Richey |
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richiro wrote: MattressMom, So I was just curious if you were still around and how your Savvy Rest is working out a few months later? Would enjoy hearing more stories/reviews about mattresses after people have had them a while. FYI. I've decided to go with Savvy Rest and it should be here in a couple weeks. Richey Richey: I am wondering how your Savvy Rest mattress is working out as you should have it by now and have had a chance to sleep on it. How does it compare to the habitat latex bed you returned because it was to soft? What configuration did you decide on with Savvy Rest? |
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Dear Richey and any others with comments, Can you let me know how your SaavyRest is working out (and what your particular needs body-wise are, and which configuration you ordered)? I bought From Flo Beds and they have GREAT customer service. Wonderful people, very helpful and kind. After lots of research (needed all organic), I was trying to decide between them and Saavy Rest, and went with Flo Beds because of their return policy. I did not expect to have to return it, but since I could not check out either company/bed in person (although they were both very helpful on the phone), I felt better having a return policy. The last bed I ordered I slept on without trying and have not been all that happy in the long run. I've slept on latex a lot--both as a child and very young adult, and then the past decade again (after years of futons and an innerspring). Anyway, I believe I've always had Dunlap, and the talaly is quite different, and I'm not sure it's working for me. I now need quite a soft bed on top but with firm support. I've had my new FloBed for 2 1/2 months and have to decide whether to keep, or return as unfortunately FloBeds does not carry dunlap). Although I think I would still choose talay for the top layer, I may need dunlap for the rest. Problem is no one carries the talay/dunlap Saavy Rest combination in my area and I can't travel out of state. I much prefer not to exchange my current FloBed, but am worried long term. Also the soft top layer seems to get quite compressed in the middle (although it eventually bounces back by the next night), but the medium on top is not soft enough for me. I have tried numerous combinations with the layers I have, but can't seem to get it right. My bed is on a slat frame (1 by 4's about 1-1/2 inches apart) Linda |
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Linda, I hope you can find a comfortable combination with flobeds. The only thing I can think of is that you consider buying a piece of dunlop to just use for your top layer? If it doesn't work you can always keep it for padding a guest bed or ? I'll say this: I could not sleep on my flobeds latex/memory foam mattress. I tried every combination and it just did not work for me. Great company though! They gave me ZERO problem about returning it and I got my refund minus shipping in a timely manner. As a result I constantly recommend them to people even though it didn't work out for me. I guess that's what they have learned: that giving a good no-hassle return/refund is the way to get customers and gain customer loyalty and good word-of-mouth. I wish more companies would operate like that! If they'd offer a spring-based model I would have tried that. Some day I might try their water bed, but it seems very pricey. Most of my adult life I slept on waterbeds of various types and loved them. Finally got tired of leaks (probably just got a poorly manufactured one, a lemon) so I switched to regular mattresses and then foam. Some day I'll try a waterbed again. [I know: they call them "flotation systems" now...] |
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Jimsocial and Linda: I have no idea which of the FlowBeds you both have purchased. The one I have looked at with FlowBeds was the all natural 4 layer mattress. This mattress has a top layer that is a two inch soft convoluted Talalay. The three layers beneath the top layer can be any degree of firmness you wish to have. They even have an extra firm layer that is a blend of Talalay and synthetic Talalay to get a more firm consistency. So I do not know why you cannot have a soft top layer and anything from soft to extra firm beneath this top layer. So I would think that if you have this mattress you can have a soft top layer and any degree of firmness under it that will work for you. As you have both mentioned the customer service at Flowbeds is excellent and they will do everything they can to keep you happy. I would recommend that you call and talk to either Dave Turner the owner or his son Dewey. I have talked to both of them and they were very helpful. But you're both right, if you do not like Talalay you're out of luck with FlowBeds as they only handle Talalay. Savvy Rest handles both Talalay and Dunlop. The Talalay is more expensive and they do not have a return policy for the whole bed although they do have an exchange policy for 90 days on the different firmness layers. It seems the laws in Virginia, where Savvy Rest is located, do not allow a re-issuance of mattresses. They have to be ground up into pillows or used as samples. Given the cost of natural latex rubber one can see why they do not have a return policy. I wish you both the best of luck getting a mattress that works for you. Don This message was modified Aug 28, 2009 by eagle2
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Thanks Jimsocal and Don for your comments. I have the all natural talalay with 3 3" layers and the thin convulted ("eggcrate") talaly on top. I have a chronic illness and pain and need quite a soft top layer but with very good support overall. I sleep primarily on my side (and some on my back) and am 5'51/2", about 130 lbs. I have the 2 sides of a queen set up differently so have tried every possible combination I think! Nothing works unless I have soft on top ; have tried medium on top and it's just not soft enough for me (in terms of relieving pressure points). Currently, on the side I sleep on, I have it set up with soft on top, then 2 firms, which is the combination I've slept the most on. This combo is not ideal, as it's still a little too firm for some nerve pain & pressure point problems. But the best I can do it seems. I've tried soft on top followed by medium, then firm on the bottom (also tried X-firm on bottom). But those combos are too squishy and lacking in support. I agree that both Dave and Dewey are very helpful, though I'm not sure what else I can try with them. Jimsocal, why didn't Flobeds talalay work for you? I do agree that they are a great company and would recommend them to anyone wanting all-talalay. Well, I have about 2 weeks to decide if I think it's going to work long-term... I truly thought all talalay was going to be great, but perhaps I need Dunlap, but without having a bed to try, I don't know... I wish there were more threads comparing dunlap with talalay, and in particular a dunlap/tallay combo.... Linda |
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Jim, did you try dunlap foam as well as the talalay you tried from flobds? And were either/both of them the all-natural or mixed? Thaks, Linda |
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linda wrote: Thanks Jimsocal and Don for your comments. I have the all natural talalay with 3 3" layers and the thin convulted ("eggcrate") talaly on top. I have a chronic illness and pain and need quite a soft top layer but with very good support overall. I sleep primarily on my side (and some on my back) and am 5'51/2", about 130 lbs. I have the 2 sides of a queen set up differently so have tried every possible combination I think! Nothing works unless I have soft on top ; have tried medium on top and it's just not soft enough for me (in terms of relieving pressure points). Currently, on the side I sleep on, I have it set up with soft on top, then 2 firms, which is the combination I've slept the most on. This combo is not ideal, as it's still a little too firm for some nerve pain & pressure point problems. But the best I can do it seems. I've tried soft on top followed by medium, then firm on the bottom (also tried X-firm on bottom). But those combos are too squishy and lacking in support. I agree that both Dave and Dewey are very helpful, though I'm not sure what else I can try with them. Jimsocal, why didn't Flobeds talalay work for you? I do agree that they are a great company and would recommend them to anyone wanting all-talalay. Well, I have about 2 weeks to decide if I think it's going to work long-term... I truly thought all talalay was going to be great, but perhaps I need Dunlap, but without having a bed to try, I don't know... I wish there were more threads comparing dunlap with talalay, and in particular a dunlap/tallay combo.... Linda Linda: It sounds as if you have tried a lot to find your comfort zone. However FlowBeds has more combinations than almost any other company, except for no Dunlop. They have the Zone latex pieces and even the blended synthetic Talalay foam pieces that give a variety of firmness levels. They even have the Euro-Slat foundation that has an adjustable flexibility built into it. This of course would be an upcharge item I am sure, but as you have already found out, David Turner is a very good businessman and will do most everything he can to have a satisfied customer. And no, I do not work for them, and have not purchased from them. But I did spend some time talking to both Dave and Dewey about my concerns. I found him to be very professional, knowledgeable, and willing to help. So I would go back to them and discuss these issues with them. I understand your concerns about the difference between Talalay and Dunlop. They are mine as well. I do not have a dealer locally so that I can try the mattresses in a showroom. I did drive out of state to a company that handles Savvy Rest. They were the closest company to where I live and it was over two hours to their location. Unfortunately they did not have an all Talalay bed that I could try out. They believe in Dunlop and only had a topper that was pure Talalay. I did find this topper quite comfortable, but it was on top of Dunlop and very expensive as it has its own cover. I am going to try out an all Dunlop bed. Hopefully by having one side that is all soft Dunlop, in a California King size mattress, and the other side soft with two medium layers, I will find a combination that works for me. I am going to be very difficult to please as I have spent over 20 years on a water bed. I sometimes wonder why I have allowed myself to get into this convoluted experience. So..... I Hear You and your frustration. This message was modified Aug 29, 2009 by eagle2
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Someone posted incorrect info about Savvy Rest - I am about to order from Savvy Rest and You can do as many exchanges as you want for 90 days! (you do have to pay for shipping but that's only fair IMHO They do suggest you give yourself a few days to adjust before exchanging) It is correct that Savvy allows no returns. One needs to spend some time on the configuration to try to avoid exchanging. Split layers for each side seems the logical way to go because you then have so many possible combos to try out if you order a few different firmnesses. Savvy has a "choose the right firmness" page for guidance on what might be best for your particular needs. One does have to pay for shipping on exchanges (twin is $90 via UPS - they send new layer apparently & a label, so you use that box to send back via UPS (so if you have a split king - you only pay for a twin layer shipping which really saves money on that exchange) I'm hoping to get it right the first time...we'll see! What I like about Savvy Rest: We need the firmess/support that Dunlap offers over Talalay BUT if we find that the soft top layer is still too firm, we can swap for Talalay so that's an added bonus! They sell 100% natural unblended Dunlap & Talalay - no synthetic blending. Their site has a couple good videos of a bed being set up and the plant in India where the latex is grown/processed. We need firm for hubby's bad back, and my minor sore back, so our split king will be for hubby: F/M/M and me: F/M/S Tons of possibilities withing those combos. My guess is that we may have to get hubby soft exchange but he wants to start out firmer. I was going to get him F/F/M but that is not recommended & I'm trying to take the advice! LOL This message was modified Oct 17, 2009 by catlover
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Sleep EZ has a pretty good rep on this board, but you are right they do seem to prefer blended latex. It would be great if we could get truthful, in depth information from someone who really new what they were talking about (scientific perspective) regarding this subject of blended vs.100% natural latex. Catlover: When you get your Savvy Rest mattress, report back and tell us what the cores look like, as well as your sensation regarding Dunlop as a sleeping surface. This message was modified Sep 29, 2009 by eagle2
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richiro wrote: MattressMom, So I was just curious if you were still around and how your Savvy Rest is working out a few months later? Would enjoy hearing more stories/reviews about mattresses after people have had them a while. FYI. I've decided to go with Savvy Rest and it should be here in a couple weeks. Richey Richey - We ordered from Savvy Rest today! And what a journey it was to make this decision as had also considered SleepEZ. So how is the dunlop working for you and pls remind us of your configuration & whether you've done any exchanges. We too ordered dunlop, king split. His side: F/F/M My side: F/M/S asked them to try to hand select firms with closest to ILD of 40 as possible, as feel 36 would not be enough for hubby's bad back. I also asked for my soft layer to be in the higher range of soft ILD so it's not too soft. (the soft in the store seemed too soft to me) PLEASE post your thoughts now that you've been sleeping on it for a bit... Tks This message was modified Oct 10, 2009 by catlover
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Got our Savvy mattress/foundation today & about to go to bed to try it out! First impressions: SAVVY REST is a FIRST CLASS operation. And they obviously know how to choose trucking companies! Competent and courteous. Professional.(there were 2 shippers involved & both super) Order placed with Michael Penny last Sat. I got email w/tracking # on Wed with tracking number. Bed arrived today (Friday) That's 6 days & included a Sunday and a holiday! Wow! The final trucker gave us a 4 hour window for delivery time - great in that my hubby could go to work at least part of the day... (I actually called shipper on Thursday because they have to give 24 hr advance notice for home delivery (as opposed to businesses) before they delivery. In my case, by the time they got it from 1st shipper, the 24 hrs would mean after the weekend for our delivery, but they said "how's tomorrow (Friday) , between 10 and 3 pm?" I never expected a trucking company to make an exception like this - or even care for that matter. And not only a 4 hr window, but the driver would call 30 mins ahead. At 11:00 am. friendly Sean called to say he's 30 mins away. And he didn't drop ship at our curb, he assessed the huge pine tree boughs and chanced driving into our driveway so he could place the boxes at our front entry instead of the curb. His only concern was the low phone wire crossing the driveway and embedded in some of the pine tree branches. I think he got out of his box truck about 5 times to ensure no damage would be done. What a nice guy! Now the bed: The 5 boxes consisted of three boxes of latex and cover, & 2 boxed held foundations. All boxes were sturdy, securely taped, strapped & marked. They were very heavy, so my hubby used his hand-truck to get them up to our 2nd floor. I suppose 2 men could have done this without the hand-truck. We removed the foundations from their boxes in the foyer, keeping the plastic cover on, and I was able to help carry them up the stairs. Savvy plastered each box with colorful stickers, in different colors, that said "DO NOT FORKLIFT", "DO NOT STACK" and something else I can't recall. Impressive. Each latex layer was loose (not vacuum compressed) but each was in a clear plastic bag. Each layer had a Firm, Med or Soft sticker on it's end. The cover was also in clear plastic, as were the foundations (which are nicely covered/padded to match cover) The Dunlop latex looks good and I like the slight aroma. Fresh-clean scent IMO. Not overpowering rubber smell at all.. Bed was a snap to put together by the 2 of us. Split layers probably help that process a bit. The zipper went around as easily as shown in the video! The only minor problem was that we received one wrong layer (a medium instead of a firm), but we think bed is firm enough as it is, so we cancelled our initial call to Savvy to correct this. Our latex is DUNLOP-processed & was to be a king split F/F/M and F/M/S, but we ended up with F/M/M and F/M/S, & it will stay this way unless it gets softer in the next couple of days...it's very firm/supportive! If you have a bad back & feel you need F/F/M, trust me - you DO NOT! Get the Dunlop but go softer - just like their site suggests (I didn't listen because I thought my DH was the one exception who really, truly needed the F/F/M! His initial impression is that it's firm enough & he wants to sleep on it just as it is now at F/M/M. (I can't tell the difference from my side to his, but he can - and we weigh about the same.) To finalize - at this point, I have to say that my impression of Savvy Rest, thus far, is that we made the right decision! Savvy gets all A's for effort & caring about details... Now for the test of sleep! Part Two tomorrow.... This message was modified Oct 17, 2009 by catlover
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Re: Savvy Rest report
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catlover said "The Dunlop latex looks good and I like the slight aroma. Fresh-clean scent IMO. Not overpowering rubber smell at all." catlover: I am curious how the Dunlop layers looked in a little more detail if you would. Were there any imperfections? Any cracks, cuts,or tears? Any discoloration of any kind? It is my understanding that 100% natural botanically grown latex, whether it's Talalay process, or Dunlop process, will have some minor imperfections. Not pristine looking. It is my understanding that the only way you can get pristine looking latex is with a blended product. But then you have a product that has a distinct rubber chemical odor, due to the fact that it is at least 60% petrochemical-based latex. I know that the Talalay I receive from FloBeds had a few of these imperfections. And the smell you mentioned is exactly the way I would describe it. A very slight sweet smell, something like cookie dough. I rather liked it. This message was modified Oct 17, 2009 by eagle2
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Re: Savvy Rest report
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hi Eagle! I should have taken photos but we just wanted to get the bed together. I can't compare to Talalay, but I'm very fussy and I, having read all the info about imperfections, was super impressed that the dunlop looked so good! I was expecting numerous burn marks from the pins, but unless I missed something, there were hardly any to be seen. And there were no tears/rips. I did cause a slight tear by my own carelessness, but it's tiny. The one unexpected thing was that the dunlop is zoned. It seems to be just 3 zones, and I do recall Michael Penny telling me (I asked believe it or not!) and he said because no one can tell the difference, he doesn't advertise it as zoned. Truthfully, I didn't pay much attention to the holes as we were assembling, so I now wonder if all the layers had zoning! We will be turning around a couple of layers when I wash the sheets again, so I'll take note and photos at that time. I don't believe this will be an issue at all at this point. The neat thing is that we also have the option of turning over each layer because dunlop tends to have an even firmer side to each layer, as the holes are larger on one side, which is said to a bit firmer. We did put the soft and one medium with large holes up, so I'm betting we'll be flipping them to smaller holes up as bed is firm and we probably didn't need to do that. How are you sleeping? It's 2:35 am & I'm finally heading up to some latex sleep! Lynn |
Re: Savvy Rest report
| Grats on the new bed! Please be sure to report back again after sleeping on it a few days. |
Re: Savvy Rest report
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KimberlyH wrote: Grats on the new bed! Please be sure to report back again after sleeping on it a few days. Last night was 2nd nite on our Savvy Rest Serenity & both slept well each night... Both of us are usually stiff upon standing first thing, but agree that after 2 nites, we both feel a bit less stiff. (I had none, but he is the one we got bed for due to degenerative disc problems & new symptom from body immpressions in our 6 yr old "high quality" innerspring that caused shooting nerve pain down his left side. He ended up sleeping on the floor on a firm chaise pad & that pain went away.) It's still too early to make a final determination, but after 2 nights, all is good & we have our fingers crossed. I think our main concerns are: Will the latex soften up will body impressions develop? My research points to neither likely to occur for tens of years & the fact that we both weight under 180 lbs, make this even less likely. Because I want to know if we could ever sleep on a cushier top without developing back issues, we will try a 2" 32 ILD Talalay layer when sheets are changed. (Got a layer from Foambymail last month when we thought we were buying a Beckley all cotton innerspring that would have been rock firm & needing a topper) I also plan on turning my top soft layer so that the smaller pinholes are on top.I put large ones on top which makes it a bit firmer with Dunlop (& giving even more combos). DH also put both of his medium layerswith large holes up to try to make up for Savvy sending a medium instead of a firm layer for his middle layer. He might also flip his to see if his back can handle a bit softer. I think it's probably negligible, but we'll give it a try. |
Re: Savvy Rest report
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Lynn said: "How are you sleeping?" Quite well Lynn, thank you. My current configuration is, on the right side of the bed, m/ef/ef, and on the left side of the bed, f/f/ef. I am still enjoying having two different firmness levels to experiment with. I very well may leave it just this way, as things are going along so well at this point in time. The experience that you have illustrated regarding getting up in the morning and feeling "less stiff" is the same thing I'm experiencing. As I stated in another thread, I think the greatest accolade for any bed is this. "I look forward to going to bed, and come time to get up in the morning, I want to stay in bed!" For me that says more than all the technical data in the world. The old saying always applies, "What works for you?" It's interesting that you say you're Dunlop layers were pristine looking, no imperfections whatsoever. I could not say that about the Talalay layers that I received from FloBeds, there were a few minor imperfections. I was told that this is common for all 100% botanically grown latex. My guess is, it all depends on how much culling out is done at the manufacturing level,and then again by the company that puts the pieces together as sold to the consumer. It's good to hear that your bed is sleeping comfortably for both you and your husband. I have a bad back and have had sciatic nerve problems in the past. This can be quite painful and if not taken care of can turn you into a semi-invalid. So it's incredibly important to make sure that whatever is wrong does not progress. A great mattress is the first step in that corrective process. This message was modified Oct 18, 2009 by eagle2
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Re: Savvy Rest report
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eagle2 wrote: Lynn said: "How are you sleeping?" Quite well Lynn, thank you. My current configuration is, on the right side of the bed, m/ef/ef, and on the left side of the bed, f/f/ef. I am still enjoying having two different firmness levels to experiment with. I very well may leave it just this way, as things are going along so well at this point in time. The experience that you have illustrated regarding getting up in the morning and feeling "less stiff" is the same thing I'm experiencing. As I stated in another thread, I think the greatest accolade for any bed is this. "I look forward to going to bed, and come time to get up in the morning, I want to stay in bed!" For me that says more than all the technical data in the world. The old saying always applies, "What works for you?" It's interesting that you say you're Dunlop layers were pristine looking, no imperfections whatsoever. I could not say that about the Talalay layers that I received from FloBeds, there were a few minor imperfections. I was told that this is common for all 100% botanically grown latex. My guess is, it all depends on how much culling out is done at the manufacturing level,and then again by the company that puts the pieces together as sold to the consumer. It's good to hear that your bed is sleeping comfortably for both you and your husband. I have a bad back and have had sciatic nerve problems in the past. This can be quite painful and if not taken care of can turn you into a semi-invalid. So it's incredibly important to make sure that whatever is wrong does not progress. A great mattress is the first step in that corrective process. Glad to hear that you are quite satisfied! I shouldn't have used the term "pristine" when describing our dunlop layers because we truly didn't peruse them all that much - we were so focused on the assembly we ignored that aspect. However, I think we would have noticed anything glaring - especially burn marks or discoloration. I will certainly take a closer look with the morning sun when I change the sheets & turn a few layers over... I do recall that Michael Penny (Savvy's owner) or his son, Gopal, told me that they have someone (and gave me his name which I didn't jot down) at the Coco Latex plant who does the "culling" for Savvy & they have established a very good rapport with him. Seems so as far as I can tell without my magnifying glass! lol Sleep well & enjoy those configurations! |
Savvy update
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It's been 9 days since our Savvy Rest dunlop split king arrived, and we are sleeping comfortably! A few things I can add to my previous posts: We originally configured our top layers (soft my side; medium his side) with larger holes facing up because we were told this is slightly firmer. I was afraid my soft top layer might be too soft, so I put larger holes up. Just for fun, when I changed the sheets I reconfigured, so now it's: Me: Firm (small holes up) over Medium (small holes up) over Soft (large holes up). Him: Firm (small holes up) over Medium (large holes up) over Medium (small holes up) My hubby's side was supposed to be F/F/M but Savvy sent a medium middle layer in error. We are testing it out before asking for the firm piece & all is good so far. We did place his middle medium layer with the large holes up to make up for having F/M/M instead of F/F/M. Each layer has a side with large holes (skin side) and a side with smaller holes. The smaller holed-sides are zoned. I can feel a slightly softer difference with smaller holes up, but my hubby says he can hardly tell. But he CAN tell the difference between his side and mine (medium versus soft tops). His side does feel firmer to me. I'm clueless about the zoning, but Savvy Rest told me no one can tell the difference, which is why the zoning isn't mentioned on his site. At this point, I have to agree with him, but I wonder what it's all about just the same. The dunlop is very comfortable. Not rock hard as someone said somewhere & almost scared me off! The dunlop is firm & supportive, yet gently yielding. It feels just about perfect Most important: there was no adjustment period for either of us. None of the usual problems with feeling bruised when a new bed is too hard. Big relief there. On caveat - when I tuck the sheets each day, my fingers butt up against the wood on the foundation so I have to slightly lift the mattress to keep my fingers from jamming into wood of the foundation. I hate this & will probably end up putting a mattress pad on the foundation. (Are all foundations like this? We have only had box springs in the past.) The foundation sides are nicely covered/padded with same as cover, but I'm not sure it goes up and over the top of the foundation. If it does, then it needs more cushioning. I'm too lazy to go double check but I do know that whatever is there, is not enough to avoid finger-jamming when tucking. I will alert Savvy Rest to this as they do really care about their product. This isn't anything that can't be corrected. Hopefully, you will be able to see the zoning in 4th photo. Note the nice quality of the dunlop, and the larger holes of the "bottom" side of each piece. We now have smaller, zoned side facing up on all but one layer. Sorry but my clear, wonderful photos have denegrated with photobucket for reasons beyond my abilities. The original photos are clear, crisp and perfect. http://flickr.com/gp/44106409@N08/28P8qv   This message was modified Oct 27, 2009 by catlover
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Re: Savvy Rest report
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catlover: Thank you for the pictures. It would have been nice however had you made them of a slightly higher resolution, as it is difficult to really ascertain any details with pictures that have been so greatly downsized. I am glad that you are happy with your mattress. I believe Savvy Rest is a quality company selling a quality product. This is my first experience with a latex mattress. I have one problem however. Every configuration that I try I tend to like. This is making it most difficult to decide what is the ultimate firmness for my various layers. Problems, problems. Oh well, I'll just have to soldier on!  |
Re: Savvy Rest report
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eagle2 wrote: It would have been nice however had you made them of a slightly higher resolution, as it is difficult to really ascertain any details with pictures that have been so greatly downsi This message was modified Oct 27, 2009 by catlover
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Re: Savvy Rest report
 This message was modified Oct 27, 2009 by catlover
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Re: Savvy Rest report
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Catlover: I only checked the picture of the whole bed, but this is what your EXIF data told me. You shot the picture with a Nikon D80( excellent camera by the way) your shutter speed was 1/60 sec, your f-stop was 3.5 your ISO was 200. You shot at 27 mm focal length (35mm equivalent) you used flash, and you process the picture in "Picture Project". But the principle item of importance for this discussion is the fact that you reduce it in size to 320 x 214 pixels resolution. This gave you a very small file size of 22.2KB. I would think a picture reduced to 640x480 no more is much better, or for a really good web picture try 800x600. The other references you make are JPEG quality. Excellent would be the least compression of the file, and the other references would be more compression of the file and thus less quality. But the principal thing you are interested in is the resolution, as I just indicated. Almost any picture editing software will allow you to reduce the original resolution of the picture file to something smaller. 800X600 is pretty much the standard resolution for good quality web pictures. This size gives good detail and a smaller size. JPEG compression will reduce the quality and size of the file but not the size of the picture. Only the resolution will do this. Do not use Tiff, use only JPEG or JPG for short, this is the best for the web, and most other applications... IMHO! Catlover we were cross posting. My guess is there is something about the way you install the picture at photo bucket that is causing the problem. I use Flickr, it has a very simple method for posting pictures. If I had to guess, and of course that's what I'm doing, it has something to do with your posting the picture at photo bucket, or the way you have copied their link here in this form. I'm sorry you're having so much trouble, I know how frustrating it can be. Everything to do with computers can be very frustrating. The older I get the more technology( which has always fascinated me) frustrates me. I have just gone through a very lengthy crash experience with my computer and try and get everything back in place even though I thought I had adequate backups. It's getting to the point that just using all of my five different remote controls for my television and sound system is becoming more than I want to bear. Oh well, onward and upward!  This message was modified Oct 27, 2009 by eagle2
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Re: Savvy Rest report
just opened a Flicker account. Will attempt to post reconfigured photos... nothing is happening....time to go to work. I feel so incompetent. How did I post the first time??? lol |
Re: Savvy Rest report
 This message was modified Oct 27, 2009 by catlover
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Re: Savvy Rest report
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This message was modified Oct 27, 2009 by catlover
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catlover wrote: but why no image appearing here? But at least you can magnify and see the detail on each photo now! :) Good job catlover. That makes a nice size. I believe the reason that pictures do not show up, nor links become hot when posted, has something to do with the security of this website. But I have no problem opening another browser window and pasting in the link. It would be good to go ahead and post the other photographs at your Flickr site with the same resolution then everyone could have a better picture of what your Savvy Rest bed looks like. Thanks for taking the trouble and the time. I hope your bed works out wonderful for you. I'm sure it will. Savvy Rest is a good company with a good reputation, and I believe you will find, with a good product. |
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eagle2 wrote: Good job catlover. That makes a nice size. I believe the reason that pictures do not show up, nor links become hot when posted, has something to do with the security of this website. But I have no problem opening another browser window and pasting in the link. Hi eagle!It would be good to go ahead and post the other photographs at your Flickr site with the same resolution then everyone could have a better picture of what your Savvy Rest bed looks like. Thanks for taking the trouble and the time. I hope your bed works out wonderful for you. I'm sure it will. Savvy Rest is a good company with a good reputation, and I believe you will find, with a good product. When I went back into this forum to check the flicker link, all of my mattress photos were available for viewing, so I didn't do links for all 6 photos. Now I wonder whether I saw all of them because Flicker somehow knew it was me, and not someone else looking at them. Are you sure you only had the ability to see just 1 photo? Tks for ALL your help! I learned a lot about posting photos....but I still wonder how I embedded the first photos I posted. Seems now I can only provide a link...I'll keep trying though! |
5 photos of our Savvy Rest dunlop mattress
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Ok, now that I figured out how to post high quality photos, I have given link to my Flicker account of 5 photos of our new dunlop Savvy Rest split king. Just copy and paste into your address area - you might want to open a new browser page... link deleted - look further as I figured out how to insert photos! This message was modified Oct 27, 2009 by catlover
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Re: Savvy Rest report
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sorry it doesn't work. You just need to copy the URL at the top of the page and post it here. The links you provided took me to the sign in page for registered users. Unless of course you have canceled your pictures. What you may have does is set Flickr up for private viewing. In which case we would need a pass word...I think. I have never used this approach as I just use the public viewing standard procedure. If you will give us the flicker URL for your home page we can see all the pictures you have for public viewing. If you do not want to publicly allow people to see your bed room then we will need the info to get into your private area. It would be so nice if this web site would not require all this process. But make it much easier to post pictures and hot links in our posts. This message was modified Oct 27, 2009 by eagle2
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Re: 6 photos of our Savvy Rest dunlop mattress
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I think you might have had trouble as I was re-doing everything so maybe not available at the time you tried to access them?? let me know |
Re: 6 photos of our Savvy Rest dunlop mattress
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catlover wrote: I think you might have had trouble as I was re-doing everything so maybe not available at the time you tried to access them?? let me know Yes, they work fine now. Good looking Bed! |
Re: 6 photos of our Savvy Rest dunlop mattress
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eagle2 wrote: Yes, they work fine now. Good looking Bed! phew....that was some learning curve! Thank you for all your help & I'm also happy to hear that all re-configurations of your layers feel good! Let us know what your final set-up is when you think you have it! |
Re: Savvy Rest report
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Trying something... Hope this works for your link... <img src="www.flickr.com/photos/44106409@N08/4050058875/"> hmmm... guess not. I'll fiddle around with it some more later on. Sorry I couldn't get it working for you! This message was modified Oct 27, 2009 by mattressnewbie
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Re: Savvy Rest report
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I DID IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!! No more need to copy/paste and open new browser!!! Here's how I did it: Open a Flickr account (free) and upload your photos. Then.... 1. go to the Flickr photo you want to post and click on that photo 2. then click on "all sizes" that appears above that photo 3. now, go to below the photo, where you'll see 2 boxes of "url/http" stuff....CLICK/COPY the SECOND BOX of jargon 4. to back to the forum and click on the envelope icon above the comment box (run your mouse over it - it says "insert/edit image".... 5. now just paste into the box that comes up and voila! Your photo should appear! I hate to admit that it took me all day to finally figure this out, but at least I feel a little bit smarter than I did a few hrs ago!...  The finished product! (with photo editing to eliminate bedside table and some clutter....)  Middle layer on left side of bed. Check out the "zoning" of the holes! Unless I counted wrong, there are 5 zones. The zoned side with smaller holes is meant to face up (the other side has large holes and no zoning.) The head of the bed is to your left...One has the additional option of flipping each layer to large holes which gives a bit more firmness, so many more possibilities!  note that both medium layers on right side of bed are "upside down"...we did this deliberately as we read that this side, on dunlop, is a bit firmer.....we are now testing both top layers with smaller holes up  when I changed the sheets, I decided to flip both top layers. They were configured with larger holes facing up. Now they are both with smaller holes up. This is hubby's side with his med layer rolled and about to be flipped. It was so easy, I did it myself. (that's the cover off to the right....)  Original configuration. Top layers have larger holes facing up. We have now flipped them over to smaller holes which is also the side with zoning. We are happy with both configurations so far. This message was modified Oct 27, 2009 by catlover
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catlover wrote: I DID IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!! No more need to copy/paste and open new browser!!! Woohoo!! Looks great! (Both the bed and the pix) ;) Don't feel bad re: how long it took you to figure it out - I'm a software engineer and I was having difficulties making it work! LOL! Now that I'm looking at the "code" when I quoted you, think some of it might have had to do with the url actually being different than the link that we were copying/pasting into the browser...http://www.flickr.com/photos/44106409@N08/4050058875/ vs http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2735/4051508938_5e3421104e_o.jpg I'm going to try something just because I wanna test my theory - sorry for "re-posting" your pic if this works... I'll edit and remove if you want! No worries! Just let me know... <img src="http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2735/4051508938_5e3421104e_o.jpg"/> Coolbeans - looks like it worked. If anyone is interested in how to post a photo just by typing in the "code", just let me know and I'll do my best to explain! Found some places where Sager66 mentions it, but he might've used some unfamiliar terms maybe? Thanks for posting all the info and pix on your experience with Savvy Rest, Catlover! I'm actually thinking of taking the plunge and getting a "made" bed from here or Flobeds vs. just buying layers and trying to put it together myself just because seems like one can be a little more comfortable with exactly what he/she is getting. Word of "caution" however - I made the mistake of emailing Flobeds and saying I had heard they started offering dunlop-processed latex, but couldn't find any prices on their site, and asked a few other questions about it, and got a somewhat condescending email in return... Here's part of the reply: "We are NOT offering dunlop. We have said to customers, if you buy our bed and do not like or cannot get the desired firmness with our wide range of Talalay latex, we will order you Dunlop, with no exchange or return of it. In my 7 years nobody has taken us up on that. Talalay in my opinion Is better in every way shape and form. The myth that Dunlop is firmer is funny. Latex is measured in ild "indention load deflection" so a 32 ild talalay vs a 32 ild dunlop, should be the same firmness, right? Well a dunlop processed piece of foam is not as supple, and has inconsistency's making it often feel firmer to the touch etc...In short, i would highly recommend Talalay over Dunlop. And i have a feeling if you keep researching you will agree." Apparently they don't feel too kindly towards dunlop! LOL! I think I must've gotten confused with someone saying that Latex International now offers Dunlop (checked LI's site and while they don't manufacture dunlop, they are a distributor from someone they think highly of), and since Flobeds uses LI for their latex, I had gotten mixed up and made the error. Doh! But I have been trying to decide between dunlop or talalay, or perhaps mixing layers of the two, so it was great to read your post, Catlover! Ahhh decisions, decisions! Ok - enough rambling. Thanks again to all for the wonderful advice and opinions!! This message was modified Oct 28, 2009 by mattressnewbie
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Re: Savvy Rest report
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mattressnewbie wrote: Woohoo!! Looks great! (Both the bed and the pix) ;) Don't feel bad re: how long it took you to figure it out - I'm a software engineer and I was having difficulties making it work! LOL! Now that I'm looking at the "code" when I quoted you, think some of it might have had to do with the url actually being different than the link that we were copying/pasting into the browser... Welcome to the group! Don't worry...once you make your decision, all the uncertainly will disappear. It appears that you can't go wrong with either Talalay or Dunlop. Flobeds & Savvy Rest are both top notch from what I've read here. SleepEZ should not be discounted either, as I think a couple of people here were satisfied with them as well. http://www.flickr.com/photos/44106409@N08/4050058875/ vs http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2735/4051508938_5e3421104e_o.jpg I'm going to try something just because I wanna test my theory - sorry for "re-posting" your pic if this works... I'll edit and remove if you want! No worries! Just let me know... <img src="http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2735/4051508938_5e3421104e_o.jpg"/> Coolbeans - looks like it worked. If anyone is interested in how to post a photo just by typing in the "code", just let me know and I'll do my best to explain! Found some places where Sager66 mentions it, but he might've used some unfamiliar terms maybe? Thanks for posting all the info and pix on your experience with Savvy Rest, Catlover! I'm actually thinking of taking the plunge and getting a "made" bed from here or Flobeds vs. just buying layers and trying to put it together myself just because seems like one can be a little more comfortable with exactly what he/she is getting. Word of "caution" however - I made the mistake of emailing Flobeds and saying I had heard they started offering dunlop-processed latex, but couldn't find any prices on their site, and asked a few other questions about it, and got a somewhat condescending email in return... Here's part of the reply: "We are NOT offering dunlop. We have said to customers, if you buy our bed and do not like or cannot get the desired firmness with our wide range of Talalay latex, we will order you Dunlop, with no exchange or return of it. In my 7 years nobody has taken us up on that. Talalay in my opinion Is better in every way shape and form. The myth that Dunlop is firmer is funny. Latex is measured in ild "indention load deflection" so a 32 ild talalay vs a 32 ild dunlop, should be the same firmness, right? Well a dunlop processed piece of foam is not as supple, and has inconsistency's making it often feel firmer to the touch etc...In short, i would highly recommend Talalay over Dunlop. And i have a feeling if you keep researching you will agree." Apparently they don't feel too kindly towards dunlop! LOL! I think I must've gotten confused with someone saying that Latex International now offers Dunlop (checked LI's site and while they don't manufacture dunlop, they are a distributor from someone they think highly of), and since Flobeds uses LI for their latex, I had gotten mixed up and made the error. Doh! But I have been trying to decide between dunlop or talalay, or perhaps mixing layers of the two, so it was great to read your post, Catlover! Ahhh decisions, decisions! Ok - enough rambling. Thanks again to all for the wonderful advice and opinions!! As for Flobeds reply to you re dunlop. I too, read that they were offering dunlop again so I emailed them before I made my decision. Here's the reply I got from Dewey: "Hello, Before Latex International came out with 100% Natural Talalay Latex we carried Natural Dunlop for our natural customers out there. We were getting "Latex Green" in from Sri Lanka.We can still get this dunlop if need be, however we do not stock it. I have often said to customers who are tentative in purchasing all talalay, "If you purchase our Natural talalay and just cant get the firmness or feel you were looking for, at that point we can order up the dunlop that you believe you want." In the last 5 yrs we haven't had to order any. We at Flobeds are very confident in both the blended and natural talalay that we carry, and offer such a wide range of firmnesses, more times than not, we can find that "just right" feel folks are looking for.If you have any further questions please don't hesitate to email back, or give us a call." They seem to be saying the same thing, but slightly more negative re dunlop, in your reply. In my reply, I find one sentence interesting - the one that offers dunlop if you "just can't get the firmness or feel you were looking for". This seems to support my research that dunlop is indeed more supportive for those (like us) who need firm support. I also didn't like the Flobeds video of the smushed dunlop they once sold and magically "found" in storage after many years. It might be for real, but just stuck me as wrong to do...They are really pushing their the talalay. Also worth noting is that Savvy buys their dunlop processed latex from Coco Latex in sw India. If you give Michael Penny, the owner of Savvy Rest, a call, he can tell you about his experience with Latex Green versus Coco Latex. It's interesting. I now believe that Cocoa Latex manufactures superior quality dunlop latex over Latex Green, so that's another point worth considering in the mix. The fact that air in injected into the talalay-processed latex seems to suggest that it would be less supportive and more springy. That's great for those wanting that feel. No air is injected in the dunlop process. Our fear was that the dunlop might be too hard but it's just wonderful. Supportive, yet yielding to our body weight (170 lbs each side). I would think that anyone over 200 lbs might want to go with dunlop process to ensure the proper support, and I've read that in many places too. The companies who offer both dunlop and talalay seem to make the most sense, as one can try both to get the support sought. I am very interested to know how to post an image in a forum like this as per your method. Pls either post info here or private email me. I'm all ears! (but treat me like a 1st-grader, ok? I'm not savvy to computer jargon!) And good luck in your decision process! This message was modified Oct 28, 2009 by catlover
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Catlover: I really appreciated all the work you went to in posting your pictures. It sure would be wonderful if you had an opportunity to sleep on an all Talalay bed of the proper firmness. Then you could give us your evaluation of the two different latex manufacturing processes as far as actual use is concerned. Without ever having slept on a Dunlop mattress I naturally can only assume what you are experiencing compared to what I am experiencing with my all Talalay FlowBeds. It has always been my assumption that since Dunlop is a more dense product that it has a different feel because of this. At least that was my conclusion based on the samples that I received both from Savvy Rest ( Dunlop) and FlowBeds ( Talalay). As you indicated, with the small samples of Dunlop they felt less springy. This was a great concern to me as I did not want a springy sensation. And I am happy to report that my Talalay bed does not feel springy. This is the problem with samples. Particularly the ridiculously small three-inch cubes that they send out. What intrigues me is the fact that Latex International sells a Dunlop product. It is a product that they manufacture under license from another company. But it seems to get very short shift from them, and I am assuming, for most of the companies that they sell to such as FlowBeds. I would assume this is a dollar and cents proposition since they must have to pay a royalty to the license company. But I have never bought the idea that Talalay was the Rolls-Royce of latex, and Dunlop was the poor cousin. I think what we will find is that it has a lot more to do with a monetary issue than a technical issue. In the end, it's all about being comfortable in your bed, for many years duration, and at a reasonable price. It's just that I found FlowBeds to have the very best exchange and return policy of any company that I have found on the Internet. And I have certainly appreciated the attitude of the Turners. They seem to be a throwback to the time when business was done based on your word and not so much with what was written on a piece of paper. In the process of acquiring my bed I went through quite a convoluted experience. So far at least, my experience with Dave Turner has proven to be everything his website and he said it would be. That means a great deal to me! This message was modified Oct 28, 2009 by eagle2
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Eeagle2 wrote: Catlover: I really appreciated all the work you went to in posting your pictures. It sure would be wonderful if you had an opportunity to sleep on an all Talalay bed of the proper firmness. Then you could give us your evaluation of the two different latex manufacturing processes as far as actual use is concerned. Without ever having slept on a Dunlop mattress I naturally can only assume what you are experiencing compared to what I am experiencing with my all Talalay FlowBeds. It has always been my assumption that since Dunlop is a more dense product that it has a different feel because of this. At least that was my conclusion based on the samples that I received both from Savvy Rest ( Dunlop) and FlowBeds ( Talalay). As you indicated, with the small samples of Dunlop they felt less springy. This was a great concern to me as I did not want a springy sensation. And I am happy to report that my Talalay bed does not feel springy. This is the problem with samples. Particularly the ridiculously small three-inch cubes that they send out. What intrigues me is the fact that Latex International sells a Dunlop product. It is a product that they manufacture under license from another company. But it seems to get very short shift from them, and I am assuming, for most of the companies that they sell to such as FlowBeds. I would assume this is a dollar and cents proposition since they must have to pay a royalty to the license company. But I have never bought the idea that Talalay was the Rolls-Royce of latex, and Dunlop was the poor cousin. I think what we will find is that it has a lot more to do with a monetary issue than a technical issue. In the end, it's all about being comfortable in your bed, for many years duration, and at a reasonable price. It's just that I found FlowBeds to have the very best exchange and return policy of any company that I have found on the Internet. And I have certainly appreciated the attitude of the Turners. They seem to be a throwback to the time when business was done based on your word and not so much with what was written on a piece of paper. In the process of acquiring my bed I went through quite a convoluted experience. So far at least, my experience with Dave Turner has proven to be everything his website and he said it would be. That means a great deal to me! Eeagle2 - where do you live? Maybe we can do a "wife swap" episode - just so we can try out each other's beds! LOL Actually, it would be nice to sleep on a firm Talalay - it sure sounds like the firmness is there. I do have a piece of 32 ILD 3" talalay from FBM, and it's not supportive at all, but not fair to judge as it's not thick enough of course! I'm am so pleased that both of us have nothing but good reports for both Flobeds and Savvy Rest! I think we have helped future latex buyers to feel less fearful on these 2 companies for sure.. If you are ever passing thru CT on I-95, please private eamil me via this forum. We are located close to both exit 4 and 5 (in the middle and less than 2 mins from either exit)...you can check out our bed! BTW - what did you pay for your bed & is it a king? Ours is king, three split 3" layers & we also purchased foundation. Cost was $3100 or $3200, including shipping...can't recall exactly, but close enough. |
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Although I would love to see New England unfortunately the wife and I live nowhere near their, and are highly unlikely ever to visit their, we'll have to pass. But thank you for the invitation. I bought the Deluxe 4 layer Talalay all natural bed. As I recall I paid about $2700 (mattress only) during one of their sales. What's a shame is that we do not have some brick-and-mortar stores in our locality, (I would be willing to drive 100 miles or so to visit it) so that we could test it out by spending an hour or so lying on the actual Dunlop, Talalay, mattresses. But even then it's not the same as sleeping on a mattress for several nights, as I am finding out as I try to determine what kind of firmness layers I prefer. Do you feel, at this point in time, that you have selected the proper firmness layers for your bed? Are you anticipating having to exchange some layers. And what will Savvy Rest charge you to do that? This message was modified Oct 28, 2009 by eagle2
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Catlover, This is Dave at FloBeds. I wanted to correct the record. Dewey was mistaken when he told you the dunlop latex on the video was Latex Green. It was latex produced under the trade name Arpico. We brought it in by container direct from The Richard Pieres Company in Regarding our “smushed dunlop”… we put it up to show our experience and why we went the route we did. I am glad you have found a mattress that works for your body. This message was modified Oct 29, 2009 by davet
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eagle2 wrote: Although I would love to see New England unfortunately the wife and I live nowhere near their, and are highly unlikely ever to visit their, we'll have to pass. But thank you for the invitation. I bought the Deluxe 4 layer Talalay all natural bed. As I recall I paid about $2700 (mattress only) during one of their sales. What's a shame is that we do not have some brick-and-mortar stores in our locality, (I would be willing to drive 100 miles or so to visit it) so that we could test it out by spending an hour or so lying on the actual Dunlop, Talalay, mattresses. But even then it's not the same as sleeping on a mattress for several nights, as I am finding out as I try to determine what kind of firmness layers I prefer. Do you feel, at this point in time, that you have selected the proper firmness layers for your bed? Are you anticipating having to exchange some layers. And what will Savvy Rest charge you to do that? We were lucky to find a Savvy store an hour away, but they only had a dunlop bed...it was a small "boutique" shop that does custom linens/bedding, so no room for 2 beds..They did have a Talalay layer but that's not the same as having three layers to try. But it sold us on the dunlop as I read one review that said dunlop felt like a bag of "wet cement". We found that to not be true in our case so went with it. It's been 2 weeks & all we've done is flip our top layers, from having the larger holes facing "up", to the smaller, zoned side "up". I need to try my hubby's side (F/M/M) to see if I might want to swap my top soft for a medium - I recall liking the F/M/M in the store, but I ordered a F/M/S as suggested by Savvy for my side. My hubby thought he could go firmer than the F/M/M at the store, so I ordered F/F/M for him ,but Savvy sent F/M/M by mistake, but Savvy will ship if necessary with no shipping charges. I am going to swap my bottom firm with his middle medium so he can try his side at F/F/M. Then he'll know what to do, if anything. Savvy allows free exchanges for up to 90 days, but one needs to pay shipping costs which are steep. I was told a twin xl (half a split king) would ship for $85. When I questioned the high cost, Michael Penny said that is the "arrangement" they have with their shipper & there are no plans to reduce this cost at this time. (If anything, it might be reduced by $5). I wonder if the shipping is inflated to discourage exchanging layers because Savvy doesn't re-use the exchanged layers (state law), but shreds them for other uses (dog beds etc) Can't blame them if they do inflate cost of shipping as I would only want new latex for my exchanges! Hubby feels it will take a month or two before he can say this bed is the best. Over the years, all beds we bought started out great for him (except the original Tempur-Pedic) but all eventually hurt his back. Our last bed was a quilt-top firm Chattam & Wells with no back issues for 6 years. But it developed body impressions (both sides, even with flipping) & about 6 months later, he began to awaken with shooting nerve pain from the impression. (pain that went away upon arising and walking, but reappeared in the wee hrs every morning). Once he moved to floor-sleeping (with 3" cushioning) he was fine. So we knew we needed firm support. We were about to buy an all cotton mattress from either Royal Pedic or Chas Beckley, but then researched latex & decided to take a chance after much research on my part. My hubby is sleeping some of the night on his stomach (something new) as well as on his side. Before the latex, he was primarily a back sleeper/side-sleeper and the back-sleeping produced high decible snoring! I find that I'm also stomach-sleeping part of the night, something which was impossible to do on our innerspring beds. I don't know why we are doing this, but it just happens. For now, neither of us is awakening unusually stiff or sore. My hubby feels his stiffness upon arising has lessened. So the configuration seems to be about right for now. I do think we each need to try the firmer configurations before making final decision & glad we can do this with the split layers! |
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Catlover: I agree with you that Savvy Rest has a high cost for return of layers as a methodology of discouraging customers from exercising too frequently their 90 day exchange of layers privilege. This business about You certainly need to take several days to allow your body to adjust to any new configuration of your mattress. I would only shorten this time frame up if you are uncomfortable. I am happy that you have found a mattress that meets your requirements and hope that it remains so for the indefinite future. |
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catlover wrote: <BR><BR>My hubby is sleeping some of the night on his stomach (something new) as well as on his side. Before the latex, he was primarily a back sleeper/side-sleeper and the back-sleeping produced high decible snoring! I find that I'm also stomach-sleeping part of the night, something which was impossible to do on our innerspring beds. I don't know why we are doing this, but it just happens. <BR><BR>For now, neither of us is awakening unusually stiff or sore. My hubby feels his stiffness upon arising has lessened. So the configuration seems to be about right for now. I do think we each need to try the firmer configurations before making final decision & glad we can do this with the split layers! Hi Catlover - that's awesome to hear that you guys have been doing some stomach-sleeping without any regrets in the AM! I miss sleeping on my stomach, as odd as that sounds... :) I will try to email you the directions on how to post an image just by typing, and I'll explain it as simply as you need me to! No worries there! I've had to explain stuff to my poor confused Mom and Aunt so lots of experience there! ;) Again, I know I've said it before, but just want you all to know how much I value your advice and opinions, especially those of you who untiringly and patiently explain stuff and offer your experiences time and again to those of us who are somewhat new to all this! Thank you! |
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I think Savvy Rest charges shipping both ways (as opposed to only 1-way like FloBeds does) AND, they don't vacuum pack the latex, so boxes are twice as large. Also dunlap is a bit heavier than talalay (the natural in each type; don't know anything about the blended). Hence the higher shipping charges. I have slept on both all natural dunlap and talalay (however not a bed with both), and they do feel quite different (even if ILDs are the same). Unfortunately I did not have 2 beds side by side to try when I was researching, nor were my past dunlap mattresses comparable in depth or ocnfiguration to my current talalay one. And except for my last bed, which was very thin dunlap, the others, albeit much thicker, were literally decades ago (eg: I had a Sears dunlap mattress through childhood, and then another dunlap one, don't know what brand, as a young adult!). I liked them all and they lasted ages, except that my last one was way too firm and there wasn't nearly a sufficient amount of latex for my current needs. After much research and deliberation I chose FloBeds, the primary deciding factor being their return policy.... it was a lot of money for me, and although I knew I wanted some kind of latex, I wanted the "safety insurance" of not losing everything if it didn't work out, as my last 2 beds I bought "untried" and with no return policy. First of these, 15 years ago, was a 2-layer organic futon--a disaster for my back, and a big loss. Second was the one with latex and wool layers which I slept on for many years, but during the last few, it was quite uncomfortable for me because of it's firmness and thin layers (not because of any indentations or deterioration of the latex or wool topper), and the last several months I was waking up literally every few minutes with severe nerve pain (some serious health problems have gotten much worse over the years, and I now need a much softer bed but still with very good support). I should say I was only in the market for a latex "all-natural" bed, meaning the 100%natural, not blended, latex with an organic cotton and wool cover and no added fire retardants. This limited my choices to begin with. I got samples from 4 places (FloBeds, Savvyrest, SleepEZ, and Habitat) and also tried out the two brands of latex beds available locally (not SavvyRest as there weren't any). I ended up ruling out Habitat because it turned out their cover is not organic and they use silica (non-toxic as far as fire retardants go, but not for me). I also called a couple of independent out-of-state Savvy retailers (who also sold other "natural" beds), and would have loved to have been able to go and directly compare talalay and dunlap beds with a similar configuration, but it turned out not to be possible due to the distance involved. I should say that all the people I talked to were quite nice and none were pushy at all in terms of trying to sell me their product (another good reason to go with the independent companies, not the big store, big-name brands). They were all helpful, some extremely so (although, because of all the research I had already done, I ended up knowing more than the two local retailers, but they did contact their manufacturers to get additional info I asked for). And most were very patient with all the questions I asked! I wish I could have taken what I found best/ideal (in terms of my particular needs) from different places. But of course that wasn't possible, and as I said, for various reasons, I ended up going with FloBeds. Dave has been excellent to work with, helpful and trustworthy. Obviously he's in the market to sell his beds, but in my experience, is clearly very committed to making sure someone gets what's best for him/her, and doing all he can to facilitate that. So truly exemplary customer service, and I would highly recommend them. |
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Hi Linda! I enjoyed reading your comments and hearing of your personal experience with sleeping on one of the old Sears dunlop mattresses! Your points about Savvy's shipping were well expressed and make sense. I'd forgotten that dunlop weighs more than Talalay, and if they are charging both ways, then $86 for a twin xl makes sense! Yes, Savvy doesn't compress their latex, so boxes are larger too. Perfect logic all around - you go girl! While I sure understand the concern about Savvy's "no returns - exchanges only" policy, the reason I went with them is that I was 100% certain that we wanted latex, and knowing that they offer both Talalay and Dunlop (both 100% natural), almost made it impossible for us to go with anyone else.... I knew I wouldn't be returning, and had the option to go to Talalay if the Dunlop proved to be too firm, but that didn't happen. I'm so happy to keep reading of other's buying experiences. (FloBeds & Savvy must love all of us! LOL) ...but most important is to offer candid comments to those still undecided & still researching! What ILD configuration is your Flobed? Did you do a split if a queen or king? And how are you sleeping since the purchase? |
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mattressnewbie wrote: Hi Catlover - that's awesome to hear that you guys have been doing some stomach-sleeping without any regrets in the AM! I miss sleeping on my stomach, as odd as that sounds... :) I will try to email you the directions on how to post an image just by typing, and I'll explain it as simply as you need me to! No worries there! I've had to explain stuff to my poor confused Mom and Aunt so lots of experience there! ;) Again, I know I've said it before, but just want you all to know how much I value your advice and opinions, especially those of you who untiringly and patiently explain stuff and offer your experiences time and again to those of us who are somewhat new to all this! Thank you! Hey mattressnewbie! I'm wondering whether those of us older than 30 enjoy the stomach sleeping (when possible) due to the fact that all of us were put to sleep on our stomachs as infants. I know that, in my case, this form of sleeping carried over to into my childhood & the early part of my adulthood. Since about 1980, parents have been told to put infants on their backs only. (however, most revert to stomach once able to roll over, so must be natural instinct to do so once able) At some point, it became difficult to sleep on my stomach without awakening with a sore lower back, so I haven't tried in years until the latex arrived! I have no clue whether the dunlop (or talalay for that matter) processed (100% natural) latex will develop body impressions over time, but unless and until that happens, I'm sleeping like a child once again! So, nothing odd at all with the desire - it' all about your childhood IMHO! Are you getting any closer to a decision? Keep us posted! |
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catlover wrote: Hey mattressnewbie!<BR><BR>I'm wondering whether those of us older than 30 enjoy the stomach sleeping (when possible) due to the fact that all of us were put to sleep on our stomachs as infants. I know that, in my case, this form of sleeping carried over to into my childhood & the early part of my adulthood. Since about 1980, parents have been told to put infants on their backs only. (however, most revert to stomach once able to roll over, so must be natural instinct to do so once able)<BR><BR>At some point, it became difficult to sleep on my stomach without awakening with a sore lower back, so I haven't tried in years until the latex arrived!<BR><BR>I have no clue whether the dunlop (or talalay for that matter) processed (100% natural) latex will develop body impressions over time, but unless and until that happens, I'm sleeping like a child once again!<BR><BR>So, nothing odd at all with the desire - it' all about your childhood IMHO! <BR><BR>Are you getting any closer to a decision? Keep us posted! Hmmm - that's an interesting theory, Catlover! Could very well be! Re: making a decision - was hoping to receive my flobeds samples in the mail today, but alas I'm all the way in PA and they're in CA so maybe Monday hopefully?? I think, to be thorough, I might contact SleepEZ and ask them for some samples as well (think I saw someone post that they had gotten samples from them, too). Already got some from Savvy Rest. Had fun playing with the latex! I don't know what I'm gonna do when I get a whole bed made outta the stuff! LOL! And actually, I kinda really liked their cover sample to be honest - saw in another post some folks thinking it might be too "rough feeling" maybe? Think the one poster said they thought it felt like "canvas"? I was thinking maybe more along the lines of a cotton tote bag if that makes any sense? Of course, that might still give off the impression of it being too rough. One of the sides was a bit softer - almost like a "well-worn" cotton tote bag? But that's just MHO! I can see how, if it were the one "less-soft" side how someone might feel it was a bit "canvas-y" and not as soft as terry! Oh! I found out there is a store a little over an hour away that carries Savvy Rest beds, but they are only open "by appointment", so going to call them and see what all they have available and try to set something up hopefully next weekend to go take a... lay? Why does that sound bad? LOL! So looks like my decision will still be some time forthcoming yet... Ugh. My poor lower back... BTW - Catlover, I sent you 2 "private messages" going into details about how to post images by just typing (per your request), but, as I suspected, it still was "interpretting" the HTML so it wasn't showing explicitly what you're supposed to type. I'd have to put in the "escape characters" and I'm a little time-crunched this weekend, but I was wondering if you even had gotten them in the first place? Let me know! Thanks!! :) |
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| Yes, a "well-worn" cotton tote bag--that's a good description. Probably better than my "cotton canvas: description, although most tote bags are made of canvas :) I did notice that the top side was softer than the underneath (not that one is lying directly on the cover anyway). I liked their cover fine (and the brass zipper is beautiful), but I love the soft, stretchy FloBed one (and the leaping sheep design!)! Wool filing was soft on both. |
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Hi Catlover, I'm still playing around with the layers, but will post back when I have it "finalized". I know what you mean about the choice of dunlap with Savvyrest, and thus your decision to go that route. That was a consideration for me to. I need a lot of support for back problems, but also a lot of softness for nerve problems (especially cause I sleep on my side mostly). Right now I'm sleeping on (top to bottom) soft, medium, X-firm talalay (all-natural). The other 2 configurations I've tried the most are soft, firm,firm and medium, medium, X-firm. I actually prefer the latter in terms of support, but still get some shooting nerve pain when on my side for any length of time. (I have a pretty complex health situation going on though). I did briefly try the zoned layer, but did not care for it. For comparison sake, I am 5"5 1/2" and about 130 lbs. My husband side (when mine is set up like it currently is) is medium, firm, X-firm. He's about 5"11 and 180 lbs. Unlike me, he can sleep comfortably on most anything, including hard futons. He calls this bed "the sponge bed"! I'll try to post a fuller description of my experience another time, as there's more I could share, but need to get to bed. I agree that this forum is very helpful to people in navigating through the bed maze---we're all so different in terms of our preferences,body types/size, health and needs, but it's still so helpful to hear the experience of others. It's certainly been helpful to me through my research, so I wanted to share some of my experience in the hopes that it benefits someone else, especially those who may be at an earlier stage of the process. |
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| Linda, if you husband thinks his side is too spongy, you might want to try putting the firm over the medium. That will give a firmer feel. Otherwise, he might prefer firm/firm/xfirm. |
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linda wrote: Yes, a "well-worn" cotton tote bag--that's a good description. Probably better than my "cotton canvas: description, although most tote bags are made of canvas :) I did notice that the top side was softer than the underneath (not that one is lying directly on the cover anyway). I liked their cover fine (and the brass zipper is beautiful), but I love the soft, stretchy FloBed one (and the leaping sheep design!)! Wool filing was soft on both. Hi Linda! Ahh - good point. Guess that's why they call them "canvas tote bags", huh? Hee! :oD I suppose I was thinking some folks might take it as more like the stiffer canvas of some types of camping gear or something of that nature! But I have to admit - having cute fluffy leaping sheep on the cover DOES have a certain strong appeal.... :oD Thanks for all your input, especially since you have experience with both!! |