Mattress Forum

Sandman, my mattress is still giving me problems. Or, I should say, SOMEthing is still giving me problems that occur during the night and go away after I get up and move around. IT's not as bad as it was before getting my Englander and not as bad as it was before changing out the HR foam for latex.

I followed you guys' advice and did NOT change my bed at all except for taking off the wool mattress cover, and I woke up with a little pain and stiffness each morning but it was manageable. However, it was getting worse after about 2 weeks of this, so I finally decided to try changing my mattress, today.

I did put the Dunlop 1 and 3/4" layer on the bottom right over the springs. I got rid of the 1/2" HR foam that was on the bottom and the 1/4" memory foam that was right on top of the springs (under the HR) just to prevent the springs from imprinting the foam. So now I have NO HR foam at all, all latex:
bottom up:
1 and 3/4" Dunlop natural, 32ILD
3/4" latex about 34-36 ILD (note this is the same latex layer I've used for a few years, never knew the ILD of it but my wife and I both decided that it is a little FIRMER not softer than the new 32ILD natural Talalay I bought, so that would make it maybe 34-36ILD. Hard to tell when it's only 3/4" thick but this is my new estimation of the ILD.)
1" natural Talalay 32ILD
No topper, just 2 sheets on top of it.

I checked the springs. They are a little softer in the middle where my hips are, and I've only had the mattress what? 9 months or so? And I have rotated it once. So this COULD be the problem. I'm not THAT fat (about 15lb extra around the middle), so I don't know why it would have broken in this much. These are 12.5 gauge springs, very heavy, so I find this kind of amazing that they show some softness in the middle after this short of a time!

Is it the problem? Could be... who knows?

This had NOTHING to do with mattresses, so you can skip it, but Leo and I are sharing our bathroom cleaning blues.

Yes, cleaning the shower and bathroom 4 times in one week did FEEL like it was about to put me in the hospital! We have a bathtub type, so the floor is not as hard to clean as a shower floor especially a tile shower floor. I found out recently that the best way to clean tile and bathtubs is with a razor scraper. It's like an ice scraper for a car except narrower, and has a sharp razor-type blade in it. This takes soap scum right off, very easy. (Well, still a lot of work, but much less work than scrubbing with comet and so on. Try it!)

Who knows is probably right.  It might be a contributing factor.   I know that you did not pay a lot for the mattress, so I have always wondered if/how they cut corners somewhere.  Cheaper steel?  Less coils?  One thing you have to remember is that it is not only the gauge of the coils but the quanity as well.  It would be interesting if you could approximate the number of coils at some point.  I also assume that they are interlaced?  I think Budgy said once that the steel interlacing the coils is cheaper now than it use to be, so that might go bad more quickly.

I noted a month or two ago that when I was trying out Sealy mattressses, the ones with higher gauge but significantly more coils, seemed firmer and more supportive than the ones with less thicker lower gauge coils. 

Having said all of that, I am sure that over the 3-4 week period that you have been using the new latex that the coils would not have changed much.  So, I doubt this would explain the sudden reversal.  However, if they are sagging more than they should (obviously they need to compress a bit with weight, otherwise what is the point), then it will probably be more difficult for you to ever get the right support.

First of all, someone was asking about the spring count in my mattress. One place told me 390/Queen and someone else told me 420/Queen.  I was told my Twin has 216 coils, that they are 12.5 gauge and double-tempered. Who knows? It is obvious that a lot of mattress salesmen just make stuff up half the time. But I am almost positive they are 12.5 gauge Bonnells because everyone said that, there was no disagreement on that point.

So I slept for the 2nd night (this time around) with the Dunlop latex included in the configuration, on the bottom next to the springs. But this time I put the wool on top to try to soften it a bit.

It was a little softer but still I did not sleep well. I tossed and turned all night, for the 2nd night. Way worse than the original configuration that was, say, "70%" good. This was like 40% good, or rather, 60% bad. It didn't feel "too hard" per se, it just felt as if the latex was pushing back too hard against me if that makes any sense to you. I have issues with my arms falling asleep and this was causing that as well (unless it was just coincidence).

So tonight I took off the Dunlop. I'm going to try to sell it. (PM me!)  I'm sure it's great for someone, but not for me! Maybe if it had been 1.5" like it was advertised as being, instead of 1.75", I might like it better or be able to use it, but at 1.75" it's just too firm. Not sure that even is the reason. For that matter, it may be mis-labeled and is really a Firm. I don't know, I just know it feels really firm to me and I can't tolerate it as part of my mattress.

Okay. So I took everything off since I had to remove that bottom layer, and put everything back the same but without the bottom layer. So now I have only the 2 Talalay layers (1.75" total) on top of the springs, plus the wool cover. I have a feeling this isn't going to work, either, but I figured I may as well try it.

By the way, part of the theory I have as to why last night's configuration didn't work is because it was just plain too much foam. It felt like when I was sleeping on pure foam with no springs; almost that bad. Before when my mattress was working I had around 2.25" of foam on top of the springs. So I will see if 1.75" is too little. Certainly 2.75 is too much, at least when part of it is this Dunlop piece. Maybe if I had an inch of soft latex on top, then it might not be too much. (?)

If this configuration does not work I'm going back to the original configuration that was at "70% comfortable". I can't take another night at less than 70% comfort level!

the higher priced Sealy coils are also an Offset spring which hinge far more accurately than a bonnell coil.  I don't see any reason why they also wouldn't hold up, but they probably are a more comfortable/conforming spring to use.  Kind of an intermittent coil in terms of benefits between heavy bonnell springs and most pocket coils.  More durable than a cheap pocket coil, not quite as conforming, but more so than a bonnell spring.