Mattress Forum

BTW, in the event you're wondering, I don't make it a normal practice to lie on bare wood slats. I was taking a break from packing up the mattress to send back, and I must say, it was the most comfortable surface I'd slept on in a long time! 

Not to overtax our resident mattress expert, but Budgy has a compelling explanation for what makes flex slat systems so great. So you might want to PM him if he doesn't make an appearance here..

Hope this helps!

The reason I was thinking about the Euro Slats is I remembered outside furniture that had plastic strips spaced apart like the Slats, and how comfy they were, and I had no pressure points.  Of course I didn't lay on my sides, but I would have hip pain if I didn't have some give in the chair.

Did you keep the Euro Slats to try a thinner latex bed?

I'd love to try an adjustable slat frame.

I have used foam just flat on the floor and I had no problem with it. Maybe if you live in a very humid area or sleep on a concrete floor at ground level it could be a problem but for many situations I think just putting a mattress - spring or foam - on the floor can be just fine. Then again, maybe some backs need some "give" under them. Who the heck knows? Now I'm back to "Woudn't it be great to have unlimited funds to try this and that...?"

So anyway, my reply to the question re inexpensive foundation for latex, is: The Floor.

Or a "regular" S company box. Many of them have no "spring" anymore, they're just wood slats with material over them. Sometimes you can get real good deals on them if the mattress store wants to make a sale bad enough.

If I were "handy", had the tools and such, I would just build one. I'd build a frame and make it just high enough to clean easily under it with a vacuum, and put slats across it. This goes back to the other thread about toxins in latex and such:

My one concern is the smell from wood. God knows what kind of chemicals they treat wood with, I have noticed that a lumber store smells pretty "toxic". I wonder, if I were to buy some wood, what kind would be best to buy, to avoid toxins? I know, regular wood, itself, should be natural enough. But it smells like maybe they treat it with chemicals...??

Anyone know for sure?  Just anothe issue for me to think about, UGH!!!

I agree Jim I need an unlimited amount of money to try all of these things.  I am so desperate to sleep more than a few hours at a time.....  I just want to sleep on my sides without pain.

There really are a variety of different base options that you can use for a latex bed.  Slats of some kind whether they are completely solid or flexible is preferrable for the airflow alone.

Adjustable/flexible slat's are even better, and the very best would be dowellings with some kind of adjustable suspension underneath.  There are lots of different ways you can build this style of base.  Some of them allow for the actual tension in the slats themselves to be adjusted, or even completely removed.  Some rely on the slats doing all of the bending where as others would prefer to use a suspension underneath slats or dowels to provide the flex.  Its all based on proper ergonomics principle, for truly optimum posture and pressure relief down the length of the body you 'might' need more than just vertical contouring support (which is what good latex will provide), you can enhance the lateral support via slats/dowels. 

Technically speaking it is much more optimum to 'zone' a bsse than it is to 'zone' a mattress, its more expensive to do it this way but it is better.  When you change the vertical support in the mattress itself by zoning it, you are negating the mattresses ability to conform precisely to body shape.  This may or may not be an issue for some people.  By changing the lateral support you can bias support to be more or less in any region of your body without interfering with the mattress conforming to the shape of the body. 

Flobeds uses a flexible slat system in one of their base options which is very similar to what Natura uses in their mechanical adjustable bases, a convex shaped slat system held in place with some kind of polymer anchor that is quite supple.  And on a few key areas there are 2 slats stacked one on the other which is held in place with some more polymer sliders that can make the bottom slat provide additional support depending on how it is adjusted.  Natura uses this type of system right inside some of their mattresses, which is just like the original mattress they ever made, although I am not sure if it was adjustable.

The reason dowelings are better is that they do not flex as much as convex slats do and they stay level while they become depressed, relying almost completely on the suspension to provide the support.  I don't want to plug the name but we have a couple different base systems from one supplier that make some absolutely incredibly foundations that use either all dowels on top of different firmness of polymer anchors or a combination of slats and dowels that sit on top of natural rubber as a suspension.  Interestingly enough I have heard a couple of people on here suggest that a 10" or higher build of rubber is best so you don't feel the base through the rubber layers....this one particular mattress that sits on the all dowellings base is only 8" of rubber and no one can feel the base because everything moves with you, it is meant to feel 'bottomless'.  Yes, even the real heavyweights don't bottom out this one. 

Now to keep some context, this thread is about what is the best inexpensive foundation, then a solid slatted base is going to be just fine for most at the price.  Flexible slatted bases are more money, and flexible dowel bases are even more, more than some mattresses actually.

I sent you a PM.  Just more questions on the Euro slat foundation you had.  What you thought of it, do you think it would break over time.

I'm sorry for the delayed response – I haven't been on the forum in a few days. I thought I'd answer your questions on the public boards in the event my answers are helpful to others.

My Flobeds' Euro Slat foundation was indeed a Queen size. I didn't notice the bar in the middle, but it was beneath 11” of latex and I'm relatively light. However, when I set up the two sides of the bed differently in terms of latex layers/ILD and happened to lie across both sides of the bed (i.e., with one part of my body on one side and the other part of my body on the other side), I couldn't feel the different ILDs on each side but I woke up in major pain. The different ILDs appeared to have contorted my body as I slept.

Re: the mattress, I got the 100% all-natural Talalay v-Zone, made up of three layers of 3” latex (with the top one 'zoned') and the standard 2” convoluted top. I tried just about every configuration of layers on the firm side: XF, F, M (bottom to top); XF, XF, F; XF, M, F; XF, XF, M; etc. I very early on gave up on the v-Zone, because it was clearly not working – so the configurations listed above were for solid (i.e., unzoned) layers.

Unfortunately, Talalay simply didn't work for me and ended up damaging my back – it took me four months on a firm innerspring mattress to recover. When I laid directly on the M latex above the other layers of latex, it was too soft for me, leading to body contortions and pain. But when I laid directly on top of the F or XF, it was far too firm, pushing against my pressure points in a painful and aggravating way. And with each passing night on the bed, my pressure points became increasingly sensitive and tender. These effects eventually led to a continuous low-grade headache, which stayed with me for at least several months after I stopped using the mattress. I rarely get headaches, and I had not suffered from any major back problems prior to all this beyond some upper back pain after extreme strain (long-distance running, moving, etc.), so this was alarming.

Interestingly, I did okay (but not great) lying on 3” of the M latex on top of a firm innerspring.

The Euro Slat foundation itself appeared sturdy and well-built. I think it's largely hand-constructed and free of chemical finishes. Also, it comes in six pieces that are easy to assemble and take apart for storage or transit. Flobeds is GREAT about customizing the foundation and they made a number of tweaks for me, including making the foundation shorter and the legs square rather than the standard round, which made me feel especially bad when I had to return the set. When I laid across the slats, it felt safe and supportive (and immensely comfortable, as I mentioned in my initial post) – although I wouldn't recommend sitting (or standing!) directly on the slats without a mattress on top.

 On the downside, the foundation wasn't perfectly constructed, maybe because it was hand-made (?). For example, the six pieces weren't all flush in some places, and one leg wouldn't screw in properly. Some of the leg casters weren't centered properly on the leg and thus protruded beyond the leg base But these were minor issues and I would absolutely recommend the foundation itself,.

I didn't end up keeping the foundation because I figured it was meant to accompany the latex mattress, and in any event I had decided to go back to a firm innerspring set, which would come with its own boxspring. But now that I think about it, the Euro Slat should work with any latex mattress, not just Flobeds'. The only thing to remember is that the foundation is covered in Flobeds' trademark sheep-patterned wool and cotton fabric, so it might not match other mattresses (I personally don't think this is a big deal).

Also, if you go with the Euro Slat, I personally would recommend using less latex. I think Flobeds sells a 9” version of its mattress, which contains 8” of latex; that might work better, especially if you're of normal or light build. 

BTW, after returning the Flobeds I tried lying on several Savvy Rest Dunlop beds, of different configurations. While I didn't get to try them overnight, I seem to do better with Dunlop, and with thinner mattresses. I think a good combination for me might be 9” of Dunlop on top of a Euro Slats style foundation, but unfortunately Flobeds doesn't offer Dunlop, and Savvy Rest doesn't offer the Euro Slats!

Keep in mind that each person is different, and I appear to have had an extreme reaction to this particular configuration of bed, which seems to have worked immensely well for many others. My troubles with this bed – which were so bad that I have developed a near phobia to bed buying – was surprising, as I am in pretty good physical condition and NEVER had a problem with a bed before. But I guess life's curveballs are what keeps it interesting!

 I hope this doesn't make things more confusing. Please let me know if you have more questions.

I'm trying another variation of the flex slats which is a lot pricier and will report back once I get it and can put decent time on it.

I was in Ikea today and looked at a couple of their latex mattresses and the slats they offer. The most expensive slat system was $300 and I can't say I would trust it, the slats were awfully thin. It was motorized, but did not have a box frame around it like Flobeds has. It is interesting to note that the most expensive of their latex mattresses, which was springy, comfy and bouncy was set on a box spring. The next one down was set on adjustable slats and it was not springy at all.

So... back to square one for me.  I may buy the Flobeds slats and get a mettress elsewhere.