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I just purchased a new FloBeds. It is the 100% natural Talalay 4 layer mattresses. The top most layer being a soft egg crate 2" piece of Talalay. I purchased the following configuration. On the left side of the bed I have a median top layer, firm middle layer, and extra firm bottom layer. On the right side the top layer is firm, the second layer is extra firm, and the bottom layer is extra firm. I felt that this should give me an opportunity to switch the layers around and come up with the configuration that will work the best for my 6' 2" 210 pound frame. It has been quite a wrestling match, reading all the different descriptions that various people like, when it comes to firmness layers. You also run into this with some of the websites. No two people seem to consider this the same way. So I'm just going to have to experiment. This is one of the main reasons that I went with FloBeds. They have the most liberal exchange policy coupled with a generous return policy. They definitely get more money than some of the other sites. But when you're purchasing something this expensive from the Internet, and cannot lay on it, feel it, look at it, and even smell it, it's good to have a situation where you can make corrections at a nominal expense. Given the fact that FloBeds has an excellent reputation with the BBB, and Dave and Dewey Turner are excellent people to do business with, it just seemed to make good sense to me to consider the extra cost as an insurance policy. One last point I would like to make. I just realize that I have been misspelling FloBeds name. I had been misspelling it "FlowBeds." Wrong! It is spelled FloBeds.com. I hope I have not misdirected anyone. It will probably take about a week to get this bed in my home, set up, and slept on. When I have had an opportunity to do this I will be sure to post back and let you know what my experiences are, as I know how confusing this kind of a purchase can be. This message was modified Sep 22, 2009 by eagle2
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Yes the difference is real between natural and blended. The difference is in the density. A 3 inch piece of natural will weigh somewhere in the vicinity of two to three pounds more for a California King half sheet of latex. By "half sheet" I'm talking about the fact that most everyone gets their beds in split layers. So a half sheet, or layer, or core, or whatever you want to call it, will weigh about 2 to 3 pounds more in a natural as opposed to a blended piece. This translates into a softer feel for the blended piece. And I am going to suppose that it is less supportive due to the lesser amount of solids that wind up in the mix. "Just my guess!" I posted some time ago a rather lengthy piece about the difference between ILD and density. You would think that ILD would give you all the information you need to be able to judge the firmness of a piece of latex. But evidently this is not so. As is stated in one of the PDF's "foam density is independent of foam firmness." so if we are going to talk intelligently about this subject we need a lot more information and understanding. The link that I will give below gives you a lot of information. Go here and read this information. http://www.whatsthebest-mattress.com/forum/polyurethane-foam -association/31-0-1.html haysdb made a very informed post about foam. You will have to download the various articles as they are in PDF format. But it is a very precise informed response to all the speculative talk we have about density and ILD and other things. I made a post about this and got no response whatsoever from anyone. This information is provided by the "Polyurethane Foam Association" or PFA. This experience with the blended piece of latex just reinforces my belief in the validity of a company like FloBeds, with their excellent exchange policy, and if need be, a good return policy. So you pays your money, and takes your chances, with so many other companies. Sandman: I will be waiting your experience with the Celsion layer of latex. Latex International is very high on this as a new potential answer to latex sleeping too warm for some people. And since this is your principal concern with latex your experience with this new type of latex will be quite interesting to hear about. This message was modified Dec 1, 2009 by eagle2
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| I take the fact that they developed Celsion as an admission that latex can be too warm. 1 inch did not seem to make much difference in the first night of testing. I am going to fold it in half to get effectively 2 inches for tonight. I folded in half 1 inch of memory foam on the other side to sort of balance the mattress out. |
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sandman wrote: I take the fact that they developed Celsion as an admission that latex can be too warm. 1 inch did not seem to make much difference in the first night of testing. I am going to fold it in half to get effectively 2 inches for tonight. I folded in half 1 inch of memory foam on the other side to sort of balance the mattress out. I believe this has been discussed before possibly even in this thread, but I will state my feelings again regarding latex sleeping warm. For me at least, I have not found my latex bed to sleep warm. Of course I think it needs to be reiterated that I slept for 20 some odd years on a waterbed. As everyone knows one of the features of a waterbed is that it has a heater that you can regulate. Since the human body has a temperature of approximately 98.6 degrees Fahrenheit I found that running my waterbed at about 90° most of the time was best. If it was beginning to sleep to warm I just turned it down. With latex I find for this time of year when it's getting cold, that when I first crawl into bed the sheets feel pretty cool. But within about two minutes I am quite warm and comfortable. This tells me that the latex is retaining body heat. How this will work out in the summertime remains to be seen. But I would think that I can turn down our air conditioner by a degree or two and if necessary just sleep under a sheet. In any event, I feel confident I can work it out. Now my wife, who has her own bed and bedroom, sleeps much warmer.Whether or not she would care for a latex bed could be another matter altogether. Then of course there are those who just prefer the feeling of sleeping on an innerspring mattress. This is what is so good about companies like FlowBeds which offers an unlimited exchange policy for 90 days, and then a return policy within that 90 days if the customer cannot find a combination that is comfortable for them. When you're spending this kind of money, and purchasing off of the Internet, that kind of guarantee is essential, it seems to me. What did you think of the information contained in the link I posted from the PFA? This message was modified Dec 1, 2009 by eagle2
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Actually I did not know you can control the temperature of a waterbed. Never really thought about it. You heated it to 90 degrees, which about what latex warms up to. So, latex is probably a good fit for you temperature wise. Perhaps 90 degress is close to the most comfortably temperature for most people. I can't have a waterbed where I live (I lease), otherwise that might be an interesting option for me. Not sure if I would like the feel though, but have never tried one. I am coming to the unfortunate conclusion that nothing will be totally satisfying for me. It will be a matter of picking the least worst situation. |
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sandman wrote: Actually I did not know you can control the temperature of a waterbed. Never really thought about it. You heated it to 90 degrees, which about what latex warms up to. So, latex is probably a good fit for you temperature wise. Perhaps 90 degress is close to the most comfortably temperature for most people. I can't have a waterbed where I live (I lease), otherwise that might be an interesting option for me. Not sure if I would like the feel though, but have never tried one. I am coming to the unfortunate conclusion that nothing will be totally satisfying for me. It will be a matter of picking the least worst situation. Sandman: I don't know where I saw it now, but some time ago I read about a chilled water conditioner for a mattress for those who sleep warm, regardless of whether that is a latex mattress or innerspring mattress. It was rather expensive as I recall,, as it had a water filled pad that fit under some kind of a cover and on top of the mattress. There was a water reservoir and an electric pump that sat on the floor. You could regulate the amount of water that was pumped through this pad and thereby control, to some extent at least, the temperature of the mattress you were sleeping on. I am sure a Google search would turn up this specific information for you. This message was modified Dec 1, 2009 by eagle2
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| I am not finding the latex bed sleeps hot. Now, compared to the traditional innerspring mattress I had before . . . well on a cold night I'd crawl into bed and shiver until my little spot of bed warmed up. With the latex bed, I crawl into bed, it might be cold, and I warm up pretty fast. But I have never had a feeling of being overly or uncomfortably warm. I've felt just right. |
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Eagle, I have seen that device. I read something that it can make noise which some people did not like. I would view that as a potential last resort at some point. Kimberly, I would not say that latex is so hot that I wake up sweating or anything like that. I would say that it gets warmer than I like. Sort of like lying on a heating pad that I would like to turn down the temperature on. It is enough to make it harder to sleep at certain points during the night if/when I wake up. At that point I feel the mattress below me and it definitely feels quite warm. From temperature readings I have taken, I know that it heats up to 90 degrees from about 72 when I first lie down. Perhaps many people are happy with 90 degrees and I would be happy at 85. Not really sure, but I assume it has to heat up to about the same temperature for everyonne, and it doesn't bother most people. An innerspring will feel warm to the touch as well, but maybe it is several degrees cooler and has less contact with the body. Therefore, it is does not feel so warm to bother me much. At least that was my experience sleeping on an innerspring last week. |
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I have slept quite well on a blended piece of firm latex for 4 nights now. As I said after the first night of sleep it feels very much like the medium piece of natural. This is due to the density factor. I will tell you this about the difference between blended and natural. You can certainly feel the difference in density when you pick the pieces up. To pick up a firm piece of blended compared to a firm piece of natural is considerably different. The density factor in natural is quite a bit higher than blended it seems to me. How this would work out in sleeping over time, and how it would work out for durability over time, remains to be seen. I would just add this final note. If you're going to be buying blended Latex International latex, I would purchase firmer pieces than if I were going to purchase all natural. The density factor between the two seems to be fairly considerable to me. This message was modified Dec 4, 2009 by eagle2
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| Hi Eagle, I know form experience that the density makes quite a difference (in addition to the ILD rating), hence the reason why dunlap rated at the same ILD as natural talalay will feel much firmer (in my experience). I wonder also about one other factor in your "experiment", that is, do you know the exact ILDs of the 2 pieces you are comparing? I know Flobeds tries to aim right in the middle of the range for each firmness (e.g. 28 for med and 32 for firm); however, if you got a piece of firm that was on the lower range of 30-34 and a piece of medium on the higher range of 26-30, they could effectively have very close to the same ILD. Some of the pieces from that this might be a factor as well as the difference in density. I'm still having formatting problems, and have no idea how to fix! So, I'm sorry this is hard on the eyes.... Linda |
| Oops, my message appears to be missing a line now. I was saying that some of the pieces form Flobeds also have the LI label still on them, indicating the exact ILD as measured by LI. Perhaps your pieces do, and you know they are different ILDs, but I wanted to mention that this might be a factor in addition to the differences in density. |