Mattress Forum

I haven't really seen any clear discussion of the quality differences. Can you point me towards them? Most of what I'm seeing doesn't point to either being better than the other.

If I remember correctly, I read it on a website of a high-end bed manufacturer. They stated that they switched to the LI latex over the Radium due to its superior consistency and higher quality. I did a quick search and came up empty. If I find the link, I will post it for you.

I also found a few comparisons of european talalay vs. LI, but to be fair when I went back and re-read them, they never mentioned that the european foam was from Radium. I may have just assumed that to be the case. I did find Phoenix's posts on this site, and bow to Phoenix's better knowledge, since Phoenix has obviously seen plenty of both.

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**** Edit ****- I spent some time looking for the link I mentioned, and cannot find it. It bugs me, because I know it mentioned Radium by name and stated that the LI Talalay was more uniform. It mentioned that the Radium Talalay had one side which was slightly firmer than the other, but not nearly as noticeable as dunlop. Also mentioned that LI has less surface imperfections. If anyone here knows the link I'm referring to, please post it.

I also think that FBM may have cast a bad impression on me regarding Radium as I understand that most if not all the foam they sell is from Radium. Theory has it that they're selling 'seconds', but no one has confirmed or denied this. MequonJim posted a comparison between the two, but doesn't mention if the FBM product was labeled as coming from Radium. There are very many posts here from FBM customers who stated their foam was labeled from Radium. Here's the link MequonJim posted with pictures of the side by side comparison: http://www.whatsthebest-mattress.com/forum/foam-mail-latex-latex-international-latex-comparison/5314-0-1.html

Did some more homework (over an entire week full time on this so far!)  SAMS clubs subs it out to a mattress company (been in business since 1970s) who does have a showroom, however in Colorado.  The bed is called the American Sleep Organic Matress #190001 for $1,999 for a CA King.  It is a 100% Natural Dunlap Latex with 1" 18ILD, 2" 24ILD, and 6" 28-32 ILD with zones built in.  I too wanted Talalay but might be too plush for my husband.  My compromise and get a topper later if I need to.  It also has organic wool & organic cotton.  With SAMS Club it is a full money back return for the first 90 days (or 60 days) with receipt AND no restocking fee or hidden fees.  I figured it's worth a try because it won't cost me a penny if I don't like it.  All the other companies have a huge return or exchange policy with it being 9%-18%. Still a lot less than anything else I've found that is ready made.

Sherry

Are you going to order the mattress with the zippered cover from mattresses.net? I'd definitely recommend it for numerous reasons. One, the entire encasement can be professionally wetcleaned whenever you want. Two, you can examine the quality of the foam they send you. My guess is that they're going to put the nicer quality pieces of foam in the beds with removable covers. The ones they send in sealed covers likely aren't going to be examined any time soon. I'm considering purchasing a new bed for my son too, and would like to know your impressions of the mattresses.net beds.

One thing I noticed in the link you sent above with the SBR vs NR numbers in it is that those were pure SBR numbers. Most sources claim the synthetic rubber is inferior in some ways on its own, but the blending process combines the strengths of both. No data to back that up other than LI's marketing blurb. Still looking for info about Radium, but I've yet to find a specific negative remark about their foam.

Also, in case you didn't notice, the video you posted about the 50 year old mattress is from the Mattresses.net guy.

Going back to budgy's point from another thread, "If synthetic latex was superior then why on earth would the same company blend any natural rubber into the mix at all when the cost of doing so is significantly higher?  it would be much cheaper to make the product 100% synthetically. "

Thread I'm referring to: http://www.whatsthebest-mattress.com/forum/this-true-100-natural-talalay-does-not-exist/18681-A-1.html  -  Definitely worth a read.

I also notice that the high-end mattresses use 100% pure talalay. The Pranasleep line at City Mattress uses 100% pure Talalay from LI for 4 of their 5 versions. They only use blended on their lowest end "Om Shanti" which is their entry level Latex mattress. Their "Wahe" version retails for over $8K, and compares closely to the Flobeds posture deluxe which is less than half the price delivered.

Anything is possible, including the fact that a 70/30 mix of SBR to NR could be stronger than either compund by themselves, but I wouldn't bank on it. Looking at the physical characteristics of each substance tells me that 100% NR would likely outlast a blend when used for a mattress. Maybe not for a car tire, but probably for a mattress. Until an unbiased scientific test is performed, no one will know for sure.

Regarding mattresses.net, I'm not overly comfortable with their website. They don't mention which latex is being used in each of their mattresses. They're quick to tell you they use LI Talalay products, which is true. But as you found out by contacting them, they also use Radium.  I'm not insinuating they're being deceptive, but from some of the posts I've been reading, you have to call them and pin them down on what latex is being used in what mattress. From the reviews I've read, they're a well respected company, and would consider purchasing from them myself. As I mentioned before, I may decide to purchase a new bed for my son. I just wish they were a little more forthcoming on their website.

I also agree that paying more doesn't actually mean you're getting more. As I mentioned in post #16, I too was torn between the lowest priced option and high-end. Obviously you decided that the lowest price option was too risky, and are willing to pay a premium to reduce risk, even though the lower priced option could turn out to provide just as comfortable a night's sleep.

I decided to do the same, albeit at a much higher premium. I did so because I like to splurge on myself every once in a while. 95% of my major purchases are based solely on value, so I fully understand where you're coming from. This one falls into the other 5%.

The mattress I purchase for my son will be a twin size mattress, and will likely either come from mattresses.net or from mattresses247 on ebay. Value will be the deciding factor for his, especially since he'll surely want a larger bed when he's old enough to move out on his own.

BTW...Regarding your statement that I'm calling LI liars is incorrect. I'm just saying I don't know if I believe them. There's a difference.

And I'm not the only one who's questioned mattresses.net marketing: http://www.whatsthebest-mattress.com/forum/foambymailcom-vs-latex-international/25931-0-1.html

Fair enough. My apologies for using too strong of a word. Just pointing out they were as guilty as anyone if they're misrepresenting facts. One thing is for sure, the mattress industry is quite rife with misinformation and questionable marketing.

I'm definitely managing my costs on this. I kinda look at it like a bell curve. The super low end of a product is usually not that great and the super high end is usually overhyped. :-) I'm a freelancer in a business that involves lots of equipment costs (musician/composer/audio engineer) and have done a ton of product evaluation over the years, haha.

I actually found Mattresses.net because Phoenix routinely lists them as a reputable dealer making a quality product. He lists them along with Sleepez, Flobeds, and another bunch of retailers. 

And also, for the record, I am considering going all natural on the talalay. Ken will do it for $250 for the whole bed and it is from Latex International. Still a deal at ~$1750 for 9 inches of LI 100% natural foam and a wool and bamboo cover (he includes that with the upgrade) including the foundation and shipping.