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The latex bounces, how wil then provide pressure relief and support? May be some support but pressure relief - I don't think so. So latex does not work. Also latex is Not comfortable since it has bounce and PUSHBACK. This message was modified Dec 2, 2011 by Joed
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GuyMakesSense wrote: I think that the best way to understand any of the foams or springs (in regards to push back) would be that if you are pushing against something it has to push back (which someone posted in the very beginning). The problem with most mattress salespeople is that we are trained to sell an item and not a science... or physics.
The truth is, when you are trying to find a sleep system that will allow you to sink where you need to (hips and shoulders) but be supported up where you need it (waist, lower back). Latex, when trying to find the right one for you, needs to allow your hips and shoulders to sink while still holding the small ofyour back up to keep your alignment correct. Too many times we "buy" the speech of the salesman (of which I am one) and do not pay attention to the way our back feels... or we don't spend enough time testing the beds that feel good at first. To top it off, we find all of the posts and reviews that are negative and completely write off a possible solution. I suggest that the method of support (coils, pocketed coils, latex, visco, etc.) while having their respective positive and negative attributes can be truly tested for you ONLY BY YOU. I use this method in my solutions presentation: "We want to find the most comfortable option in the following four areas..."
Ultimately, once you have done some research on what to expect to spend and then testing to prove your levels of comfort, you will find that more expensive does not necessarily mean more comfortable or even better. According to Englander's website (which I do not carry) you should expect to find a GOOD queen set (not specialty) coiled mattress for between $1000 and $1500 dollars (which should include the customer service elements of warranty, delivery, comfort exchange, durability and comfort). Specialty will probably be more, but there are options that can easily put you into that range without having to break the bank. Easy test: Go find 5 pillow top mattresses in your local store (tell the sales agent to leave you alone... seriously) at 5 different price points. You will probably find that the top 2 or 3 can feel really good without having to like the most expensive one... hope this helps!
Sleep Well 'joed"! |
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Joed wrote: I don't know about other people. But I got the softest latex mattress and it is killing me. I am returning it. I got taken in by the salesmen pitch. The soft latex is only soft for less then 1 minute and then it starts to pushback. I sink in too much and it is pushing back firmly. I now have shoulder pains with I did not have before I bought this. I sleep on polyurethane sofa which does not pushback.
I have tried tempurpedic beds. I found that basic cloud is too firm for me. The other cloud series - I sink in too much and am touching the base foam. I have tried the contour series. I find them too firm for me. I have tried Rhapsody at a friends house. It strated fine and it fizzled. It softened up where I weighed the heaviest - hips/buttocks. I have tried sleeping on allura. And it is only "seems" good when I sleep on my back. and finally I can't afford a 7000 dollar Grand bed. So if there is any "soft latex bed " in "real life" kindly tell me. Because I have not found it. I don't know why budgy is telling "99%" of the people like latex.To me right now is just uncomfortable piece of rubber which they fancifully call "latex". Beware of the salemen. I might just go back to springs. You still have not answered my question about whether your mattress truly is all latex....did you read the law label yet to see the material contents? |
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DaveStro wrote:
Not sure why you are saying Mattress Firm doesnt carry latex mattress. They have latex on their website and in the local stores around here. They also talk about the reason some of the Simmons or Sealy mattress's sets are so expensive is because they use latex and latex is one of the highest quality materials you can get in the bedding industry. This is what their sales reps will tell you. Mattress Giant also sells Latex beds, so does sleepy's as will most of your largest mattress compainies. None of those compaines has stopped carrying latex beds so you might want to check your data again. Many funiture stores do not carry latex, but even most of the larger funiture stores and/or high end funitures will carry latex beds. it is naive to beieve all mattress retailers would carry them if it was a great product. Tempurpedic is a great product, but not all retailers carry them. Sealy Makes great mattress sets, but not all retailers carry them. So stating "If a product is so good all retailers would carry them" is flawed. Your "claim" about latex's pushback is a not true. After my experiences, I have learned not to trust salesmen. This message was modified Dec 7, 2011 by Joed
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budgy wrote:
You still have not answered my question about whether your mattress truly is all latex....did you read the law label yet to see the material contents? To repeat, It is 6 inch of latex on 8 inches of soy foam. 2 inch of celsion over 1 inch of dunlop over 3 inch of talalay. All over 8 inch of soy foam. This message was modified Dec 7, 2011 by Joed
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| And based on this mattress you say latex is no good for anyone? theres a whole lot of polyfoam in the mattress itself too...I bet if you cut open the top quilting layer it is a thin layer of polyurethane before the latex too. |
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Joed wrote:
Your "claim" about latex's pushback is a not true. After my experiences, I have learned not to trust salesmen. |
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Joed wrote:
To repeat, It is 6 inch of latex on 8 inches of soy foam. 2 inch of celsion over 1 inch of dunlop over 3 inch of talalay. All over 8 inch of soy foam. Latex has been around since the 40's and is still the longest lasting material in the bedding industry. Still need a few more years in to tell if Tempurpedic will hold as long and they are making a good showing. Dont get me worng. I am not saying the High Density Memory foams are a bad product or worse then latex. They are both excellent products with great support and durability. To choose one fromt he other is really a matter of personal preference for comfort. |
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Just a suggestion you might try before anyone gives up on their latex- make sure it's not bound too tightly, and that there's as little as possible between your body & the latex itself. Once I ditched the very nice but too thick embroidered mattress cover, and cut off the really tight fabric that the latex block was directly cased within, the feel was 100% different. ONly then could my shoulders & hips sink in enough so that the foam between those points could rise to support the arch of my back. Nothing between myself & the latex except one sheet & a wrap-around cover that's as thin as a sheet, & a set of actual springs under the latex- then all my foam & foundation swapping ended. While the exact opposite was necessary for me to sleep on memory foam- the thicker & tighter the encasement, the less I found the memory foam shied away from the contours' heat it contacted. Ultimately memory foam or latex depends on what your biggest problem is, pressure points or support, but sometimes little details in what's above & below the foam itself can result in huge performance changes for you. It's just tough to draw blanket conclusions of either in a vacuum, especially for how different we all are, and how differently they can all be setup.
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In my extensive mattress shopping this year, I found it 'insanely difficult' to really know a mattress from trying in the store. Man, what a difference it makes from trying a mattress for 15 minutes at a time to sleeping on it for 8 hours a night. I laid on the iComfort Revolution SO much before buying it, it was ridiculous. I really thought it was going to work. I could detect no problems in the store. It didn't seem like my back or neck would have problems with it. I had no idea it would end up sleeping a little warm. It took a week or two weeks for neck discomfort to emerge. I hear some states don't allow returns on mattresses. That's insane! Mattress shopping for quite a few people is one of the most difficult things to choose among. People in great shape and no joint problems can sleep on most things, stay in various hotels and do fine. Then there's the rest of us who need specialty mattresses. |
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Joed wrote: I don't know about other people. But I got the softest latex mattress and it is killing me. I am returning it. I got taken in by the salesmen pitch. The soft latex is only soft for less then 1 minute and then it starts to pushback. I sink in too much and it is pushing back firmly. I now have shoulder pains with I did not have before I bought this. I sleep on polyurethane sofa which does not pushback.
I have tried tempurpedic beds. I found that basic cloud is too firm for me. The other cloud series - I sink in too much and am touching the base foam. I have tried the contour series. I find them too firm for me. I have tried Rhapsody at a friends house. It strated fine and it fizzled. It softened up where I weighed the heaviest - hips/buttocks. I have tried sleeping on allura. And it is only "seems" good when I sleep on my back. and finally I can't afford a 7000 dollar Grand bed. So if there is any "soft latex bed " in "real life" kindly tell me. Because I have not found it. I don't know why budgy is telling "99%" of the people like latex.To me right now is just uncomfortable piece of rubber which they fancifully call "latex". Beware of the salemen. I might just go back to springs. A new mattress truly is like a piece of machinery at your local gym. Let's use a treadmill and an elliptical machine. Many people can "run 5 miles" on a treadmill and when they are first introduced to the elliptical, they can barely finish 1-2 miles. Is it fair to say the elliptical machine is a failure or the incorrect machine? Simply put, no. the elliptical machine uses your arms as well as your legs AND it is a very controlled motion for the muscle groups in the lower half of your body. If you keep trying the elliptical for the next couple of weeks, you find that pretty soon you are up to yuor "5 miles" and you have stopped sweating like the entire army in basic training! You may still even feel some soreness for those several weeks as you keep pushing yourself on the elliptical, but ultimately you can feel the benefits and your body continues to adapt. The longer you have slept on a bed in poor condition, or with the wrong support or levels of comfort for you, the longer it may take to find the correct bed for YOUR needs. It seems that throughout these posts you have tried several things to no avail, but I have not seen (and I may have missed it) how long you have actually tried some of these beds (it is a lot to read to get all of the facts) but I submit that any soreness felt during the first 5-8 weeks could literally be the change your spine and back muscles experience as they are experiencing the benefits of the new sleep system... if the problem, though is in the pressure points on your hips or shoulders, that won't change with extended use once the bed has been conditioned (or broken in). As a reminder, I am a sleep consultant and have been doing this for only about 5 years, but I spend countless hours reading, researching and discussing the effects of different support systems and different physical response of individuals so that I stop trying to sell a square and spend more time custom fitting my clients with the proper comfort, support and price. Even with 90-120 days to make an exchange or return, I have less than 4% of my sales ever come back because of the time I spend listening and discussing their responses and less time talking about the things my manufacturer reps tell about why their bed is better than everyone else's... millions of backs and almost as many sleep systems, just gotta find the right one for you!
Sleep well, Joed! |